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Could they be in foal?

Equine-Reproduction.com Bulletin Board » General Mare Questions - Volume 2 » Could they be in foal? « Previous Next »


Author Message
 

Wendy Burnside
Nursing Foal
Username: Riddlebrook

Post Number: 15
Registered: 08-2007
Posted on Thursday, December 04, 2008 - 06:28 am:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I have 2 mares that run with a stallion last year from december to april. I suspected they were in foal and had them palpated by a vet who said he didnt think they were in foal. Is it possible the vet missed the pregnancy? Does she look at all in foal to anyone else? Her belly is constantly changing shape, often looking square etc...
http://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s314/riddlebrook/RoxyDec08.jpg
http://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s314/riddlebrook/RoxyDec083.jpg
 

Bobbi Govro
Senior Stallion or Mare
Username: Hh_farms

Post Number: 1070
Registered: 03-2008
Posted on Thursday, December 04, 2008 - 11:18 am:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Wendy: Is your sorrel a maiden? If so, then yes, I would say that she is quite possibly in foal.
 

Wendy Burnside
Nursing Foal
Username: Riddlebrook

Post Number: 16
Registered: 08-2007
Posted on Thursday, December 04, 2008 - 05:40 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Yeh Bobbi she is a maiden.. I just cant understand how a vet could get it wrong though. But at the same time im not convinced he is right. She was moving alot on him as i dont have a crush. Dont know if that would make a difference.
Cheers
 

Wendy Burnside
Nursing Foal
Username: Riddlebrook

Post Number: 17
Registered: 08-2007
Posted on Thursday, December 04, 2008 - 06:08 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Just thought i might add pics of the grey too. She is not a maiden.. What do you think to her, and how far along would you guess they are if they are?? With the time frame i have i guess they can only have 3-4 mths at the most left.
http://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s314/riddlebrook/NickyDec081.jpg
http://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s314/riddlebrook/NickyDec082.jpg
Thought i would also add, they were palpated in mid october
Cheers
 

Diana Gilger
Senior Stallion or Mare
Username: Kdgilger

Post Number: 1538
Registered: 01-2008
Posted on Thursday, December 04, 2008 - 06:27 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

the grey doesn't really have that look about her. But I believe the sorrel does....I've had vets miss it before! And I've known a few (from this board) who've missed it a couple of times!
I'd have her rechecked...
 

Katherine DaSo
Weanling
Username: Soarsamongstars

Post Number: 38
Registered: 10-2008
Posted on Thursday, December 04, 2008 - 08:37 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Wendy

both of these gals have been going through this with me.... I had a mare exposed to a Stallion, was concerned because she bagged up bagged down (she is Maiden) her belly changes shapes she shows all the signs... now while your prolly going "this has what to do with me" ha ha.... I had her palpated by a Vet, she moved around a LOT on the Woman even sedated and the vet told me she felt NO FOAL, that any movement I might have felt had to be gas, and my mare was having a hormonal issue which was why she bagged up...

My Mare is expecting (I get her U.S tomarrow to get a guesstimate on due date) and the vet missed the foal...she was wrong. Go with your gut instinct sometimes vets can miss things
 

Wendy Burnside
Nursing Foal
Username: Riddlebrook

Post Number: 18
Registered: 08-2007
Posted on Friday, December 05, 2008 - 12:11 am:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Katherine, im curious to know how far your mare is, at what stage she was palpated and the vet missed?
Cheers
 

Bobbi Govro
Senior Stallion or Mare
Username: Hh_farms

Post Number: 1076
Registered: 03-2008
Posted on Friday, December 05, 2008 - 09:03 am:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Wendy:

Well...I'm going to play the devil's advocate here and say that I think they are both in foal.

How can a vet miss it? Pretty easy actually when doing palpation. If you ever want to put you mind at ease, just google pregnant mare signs sometime and read up on lots and lots of palpations that are mis-diagnosed. When I pregnancy check my mares, I (most of the time) choose palpation because its "economically more favorable" unless there are extinuating circumstances (such as a possible twinning, etc). I feel that I have some awesome vets but they have been quite honest that palpation is not always the most sure method. In fact, my wonderfully humorous vet says that the most sure method is the appearance of feet protruding. Ha! Evidently, palpation works well during the very early stages (1st 3 months) and the very late stages (last 3 months) but the in-between is much more difficult as the fetus drops below the pelvis bones and is much more difficult to reach or feel. In fact, with my maiden last year, we became increasingly concerned that at around 8-9 months she was carrying twins...whoops...too late to pinch one off...but we wanted to check to prepare ourselves for what was coming down the road. With palpation, all my vet could tell was that there was at least one and that she could just barely feel the nose. So, in answer, yes, vets can be wrong during palpation...doesn't make them bad vets...just means that palpation is not always the most efficient means of determining pregnancy.

I would say that your sorrel is much farther along than your gray. But, she's a maiden and the gray isn't. That can make a big difference. Seasoned broodmares have already been "stretched out" so sometimes they aren't as obvious with the belly situation and it can be a fooler. My experienced mare doesn't really show the "foal belly" until about the last two months...other than that she looks the same throughout her pregnancy as she does shortly after she foals. My black mare carries her foal differently and tends to get that "barrel belly" look and doesn't get that dropped foal belly until the last 3 months. My sorrel mare...well, we're still out to lunch on her...she carries her foal low and therefore its difficult to tell if its a foal or a saggy, hay belly.

I'm going to say your sorrel is around 8-9 months prego and your gray...hmmmm...more like 6 months prego.
 

Holly
Senior Stallion or Mare
Username: Bonny

Post Number: 1063
Registered: 03-2008
Posted on Friday, December 05, 2008 - 09:09 am:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I vote yes on the Sorrel Mare and questionable on the gray mare.
Pretty Girls!
 

Katherine DaSo
Weanling
Username: Soarsamongstars

Post Number: 40
Registered: 10-2008
Posted on Friday, December 05, 2008 - 11:17 am:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Wendy she was palpated last month the Ultrasound today places my Mare at 10 months. so at 9months she was palpated and missed. If the foal moves or shrinks down or is small (apparantly mine is having a large foal) they can be missed. Poor Holly Diane and Bobbi had to keep me sane until my vet appointment today. Makes you feel better to know that it is possible to be missed doesn't it??

I was certain myself but HAD to know for sure so I set up an appointment for an U.S to alleviate the concern and lo and behold today I find out my mare is in the late stages of her pregnancy and was missed LAST MONTH with a palpation!!! If your Mare is at least 7 months try a 'bump test' this is what I used to confirm my suspicions before I could get an U.S. If your mare is carrying low (that far along she would be) reach to the lower belly towards the udder and press around, trust me in the right time you WILL feel the baby, I find that my foal was more active early morning and early evening...and once you feel it it makes you feel at ease. just press around it feels.... unmistakable sometimes you can watch the baby move too in the flank area... and don't feel so bad Until today I was playing the "I think she is but maybe she isn't' game
 

mariana cremonte
Breeding Stock
Username: Mariana_cremonte

Post Number: 266
Registered: 05-2007
Posted on Friday, December 05, 2008 - 11:19 am:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

hi, I also vote pregnant on the sorrel, and a MAYBE on the gray -I donīt like taking risks!-. Cuties!.

I also have a question, my mare Arasumi has a 1 yr old colt who was weaned 5 months ago. But she is now bagging up. As far as I know -she is in a club- she was not exposed to a stallion. I called the vet he sayed probably hormonal thing. She does not look pregnant (comparing with her last pregnancy). Do you still think she could be? I am getting my hopes up and probably in vane.
I guess my question is: what do you think is more likely, that a stallion found her way or an hormonal isuee? is it common for a mare to have those hormonal issues?. Vet is coming on tuesday.

Thank you!!!!
I did not wanted the trouble/suffering of another pregnancy but I would definilty LOVE another foal!.
 

Bobbi Govro
Senior Stallion or Mare
Username: Hh_farms

Post Number: 1081
Registered: 03-2008
Posted on Friday, December 05, 2008 - 01:39 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Mariana: I guess my first question is...has she been in the vicinity of contact with a stallion?
 

Katherine Kehamas Wind Dancer Due Jan
Weanling
Username: Soarsamongstars

Post Number: 44
Registered: 10-2008
Posted on Friday, December 05, 2008 - 02:17 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I have to agree with Bobbi, things happen and if a mare does cycle and a stallion is nearby well... I do have a mare that was purchased as a broodmare, I ride her now but Her hormones will do that, she will just 'bag up' but has NO contact with a stallion (it was actually why I had to adopt her out before I got her back)couldnt have a pregnant horse on base.... turns out it was just her hormones...
 

Wendy Burnside
Nursing Foal
Username: Riddlebrook

Post Number: 19
Registered: 08-2007
Posted on Friday, December 05, 2008 - 06:25 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Thanks so much for your opinions gals you are so helpful.I feel there is a glimmer of hope and that i am not going crazy. Yesterday i noticed my grey mare has what i am thinking is the milk vein?? Im not sure what this is or what it should look/feel like.. But she has a filling in front of her teats and i could express milk?? The lumps are not soft like fluid more like jelly. My pics came out crappy but see what you guys think.

http://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s314/riddlebrook/Picture2002.jpg

I can understand nothing is perfect and things get missed, My vet was just so confident that he is never wrong, made me feel like there is no chance he could be wrong.
Cheers
 

Katherine Kehamas Wind Dancer Due Jan
Yearling
Username: Soarsamongstars

Post Number: 52
Registered: 10-2008
Posted on Friday, December 05, 2008 - 06:34 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

so was mine and Im about to welcome a new foal into the world...

the milkvein runs along the side of the horse and then underneath. I couldnt tell by your photos very well, but there are a lot of experianced people on here that can make heads or tails from it. It looks to me to be a possibility, but I could be wrong. her udder looks like my girl Dancer's did for awhile. if your not certain do a bump test or get her U.S to be certain. I just learned today that vets arent always 100percent with palpating...
 

mariana cremonte
Breeding Stock
Username: Mariana_cremonte

Post Number: 268
Registered: 05-2007
Posted on Tuesday, December 09, 2008 - 08:03 am:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I am not sure from the picture Wendy, but I think it also depends on how her teats were before, if you think they have changed then you are probably right!.

Bobbi and Katherine, in the place she was last year there were a couple of stallions. One of them broke three lines of hot wire to get to her, she was in foal heat but -literally- kick him off, many people saw that incident and told me nothing -else- happened. But maybe he did it again and I was not informed?. She does not look pregnant dough.
PD the misbehaved guy is now a gelding.



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