Hi guys, just wondering if anyones ever encountered this. recently got a retired show mare in. Was on depo provera x 4 years, has not had any since 01/08. The few cycles I have seen have been 3 days tops. I think her most recent may have only been one day -- not surprising since we are getting longer days. Bred it 3 times, live cover. It was receptive and stood to be bred no problem. However. no pregnancy. currently trying to catch her 'in' and get her cultured to be ready for next year. However no fluid on u/s and cytology was negative. ( ls about why we got cyt and no cult.)
I am wondering about the testosterone because last week one of my old retired but very fertile mare was in season. We don't own a stallion, nor have one anywhere in the neighborhood.
I have one gelding who is a good teaser. However this mare was totally uninterested in him, but admant that the show mare was a stallion. They all live out, older mare insisted on breaking down at the open show mare at every opportunity. Open mare did not take any male interest in her that I saw, mostly ignored older mare.
I didnt think much of it.. figured even though shes been home from stud farm x 3 weeks, maybe some lingering phermones or something. Older mare probably ovulated 3-4 days ago or so..
But today, older mare pooped and walked off and show mare came over kicked the pile around and then was trying to pee on it -- very deliberatly.. looked like she was marking her territory -- like my teaser gelding does.
Also, this morning, she chased the little teaser gelding out of my little herd repeatedly. She seems to be taking on some very stallion like charecteristics and I'm wondering if it's possible that due to consistent use of Depo Provera, if the show mare is creating an over abundance of testosterone. -- the teaser gelding is a 2 yo, was cut a little late, and 'likes the girls'. Show mare has prevsiously (first few days of july) broke down for him when in season. I think her last cycle ( the 24 hr one) was 8 9 08 so she may be getting ready to come 'in' again..hopefully can get her cultured.
im just wondering if anyone else out htere has run into this and what the best way to resolve it is. Provided shes clean, im going to let it ride until February, then I'm wondering maybe if a regumate series might set her straight? would love to hear your thoughts!
Mares that have granulosa cell tumours ultimately synthesize over-production of estrogen to testosterone, but I don't think that the behaviour that you are describing is particularly suggestive of that. It sounds more as though the mare is just a dominant mare. The prolonged use of progestins in a time-release format (Depo-Provera) is more likely to be an issue that is impacting the mare.
You may want to read the article about breeding the older maiden mare, as I suspect that article references more of the situation that you are encountering (follow the link).
Thanks Jos! I'd read about the granulosa cell tumors, and I couldnt decide if we applied. And my vet has u/s her repeatedly and never mentioned seeing anything. We typically map cysts out and stuff, so im sure if the tumor was there she would have mentioned it.
She is very much an alpha mare, second in command to the retired older mare, who is THE alpha of that herd to which no one dare challenge - she also is 15 years older than the show mare who is 8 years old and has had a foal as a 4 year old (she jumped the fence as a 3yo) owners sold her, and when she popped out a baby as a 4yo, new owners called and advised old owners she had been in foal.
none the less. thanks for your advice, will read the link and see if i cant get her figured out before next breeding season!
Please note that opinions, product information, advice or suggestions posted on this bulletin board are not necessarily those of the management at Equine-Reproduction.com nor does the maintenance of the post position indicate an implicit or any endorsement of that information, opinion or product.
Further, although we have the greatest respect for the posters offering assistance here, you are advised to seek a consultation with your veterinarian prior to using information obtained from this board if it is of a veterinary nature.Proud to be sponsored and supported by: