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Only have a weekend to breed......any hope?

Equine-Reproduction.com Bulletin Board » General Mare Questions - Volume 2 » Only have a weekend to breed......any hope? « Previous Next »


Author Message
 

Kathy Simmons
Neonate
Username: Tuper

Post Number: 1
Registered: 06-2007
Posted on Tuesday, June 19, 2007 - 05:12 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

So here is my situation....and I have tons of questions, so please bear with me!

I have kept track of my mare's heat cycles, and she SHOULD be going into heat tomorrow. I am taking her to the stud who is out of state on Saturday and Sunday. That *should* be on day 4 and 5 of her estrus cycle. Of course, this is all depending on her! I am taking her to the vet on Friday for the health certificate and a general check over. Is there anything specific I should ask for that would aid in her actually conceiving? I was hoping to get the HCG shot to give to her at the time of breeding, but don't know much about it. If her follicle is not ready, will it cause harm? When exactly should I give it to her? Of course, I will ask the vet these things, but I would like to know a little beforehand. Also, she is on a daily dewormer....Strongid CX2. Is this going to be a problem? I still use the paste dewormer on her on the regular schedule (3 months) as I know that the daily only kills adult worms. She has been getting a biotin supplement and mare plus for the past two months. Her yearly vaccines are due next month, should I wait to get them for her, or should I do it before she's actually bred? I don't plan on taking her anywhere after this breeding. She is a tad of a worry wart as well....not too bad, but I wanted to give her some calmex for the trip there and back. Would that be okay?

That's all I can think of for now, I'm sure I have a few more questions I forgot about. THANK YOU so much for any and all suggestions/help!



Edited because she did come into heat today! Yay! She's on track so far. Now I just have to keep my fingers crossed that she won't ovulate until day 4 or 5. I am going to have the vet ultrasound on Friday. I'm still open for advice!!!

(Message edited by tuper on June 20, 2007)
 

Kathy Simmons
Neonate
Username: Tuper

Post Number: 5
Registered: 06-2007
Posted on Thursday, June 21, 2007 - 12:32 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Just thought of another question......

I know it's best to breed every other day, but since she will only be there on Saturday and Sunday, we are going to breed her once on both days. Early on Saturday and later on Sunday. And then we will be trailering home on Sunday night. Do you think this wil lessen the chances of her conceiving? She does worry a bit about travel, but she more internalizes than anything. Thanks for the advice!
 

Kat
Weanling
Username: Kat

Post Number: 26
Registered: 06-2007
Posted on Thursday, June 21, 2007 - 12:43 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Don't know if this helps or not...but when we bred my mare, we only bred her one day and the stallion only covered her one time.
Had to leave after that because of a phone call I got.

She was pregnant. 355 days later I had a filly.
That's 100% conception. It was just pure luck I guess.
But it does happen.

Good luck !
 

cathy Cook
Breeding Stock
Username: Razmacat

Post Number: 261
Registered: 08-2005
Posted on Thursday, June 21, 2007 - 01:50 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I would fist have her palpated Friday and see what her follicle is. Your trip would be in vain if she has only activity and no real follicle big enough for HCG. Also don't waste your money on the HCG or desorelin shot if the follicl is not big enough. The follicle has to be of decent size for these drgs o work. As far a vaccinating, I don't give my mares anything until they are 90 days in foal. Just rule of thumb evrey horse not in foal on my farm gets vacinated in January, mare in foal are vaccinated one month prior to foaling. ZIf her follicle does no cooperate why not just leave her at the farm the stallion is at. I have thoroughbreds and we only cover each mare one time per heat cycle. So if your vet can tell you where you sit follicle wise you can decide if you want to breed either Saturday or Sunday, not both cause that would just pollute her repro tract.
 

Kathy Simmons
Neonate
Username: Tuper

Post Number: 6
Registered: 06-2007
Posted on Thursday, June 21, 2007 - 05:32 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Thanks for the advice and tips!

How big of a follicle should she have in order for the HCG shot to work properly? Do mares not make a follicle every heat cycle? Can a vet just palpate for it or does it need to be ultrasouned? The vet unfortunately is much more knowledgeable about cows than horses, and most people around here just throw thier horses out in pastures to breed.

I could leave her there at the farm, but I was hoping not to. It's a 12 hour round trip, so thats the reason for trying to get it done all in one weekend.....trying to save myself a trip with gas prices as crazy as they are!
 

cathy Cook
Breeding Stock
Username: Razmacat

Post Number: 262
Registered: 08-2005
Posted on Thursday, June 21, 2007 - 10:25 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Your follicle needs to be at least a 20mm for the HCG to work. My vets can palpate that but some have to ultrasound for size, ask your vet. Yes horses should have follicles with each cycle but you have to monitor size and feel. The softer it is the closer you are to ovulation. If I breed a mare on a 45mm soft I am in heaven!
 

Kathy Simmons
Neonate
Username: Tuper

Post Number: 7
Registered: 06-2007
Posted on Thursday, June 21, 2007 - 10:35 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Thank you so much for the advice! I will try to hop on here tomorrow to let you know how the visit went!
 

Kathy Simmons
Neonate
Username: Tuper

Post Number: 8
Registered: 06-2007
Posted on Saturday, June 23, 2007 - 07:07 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Ok, I have a quick minute, just wanted to update.....

Vet said that the follicle was somewhere between 30-40, gave her the shot yesterday morning, and she was covered today. Things went very well!

They wanted to cover her again this afternoon, but I declined. We might try again tommorrow, but I'm not sure if I want to. I'm worried that she might get hurt or something. There was the slightest tint of blood in her vulva after they were done today. I looked in there really well and couldn't see any visible tears. He's a young stallion, and although I trust that the handler knows what is supposed to go on, he needed a bit of help finding the right spot. But the job got done, and my mare was a champ. They were cleaned up and acting completey normal afterward. About 4 hours later, she had about a teaspoon or so of white gooey discharge.....is this normal? (I'm pretty sure I know what it is.....but I have to ask!)

So there's my update! This has been very emotionally draining so far, I can't believe people do this on a regular basis! If she catches, this will be my one and only baby....don't think I can handle the stress over again!
 

Jos
Board Administrator
Username: Admin

Post Number: 1383
Registered: 10-1999
Posted on Saturday, June 23, 2007 - 11:48 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Your follicle needs to be at least a 20mm for the HCG to work.

Wrong! Wrong! Did I say Wrong???!!!

For hCG to induce ovulation, the follicle must be at least 35 mm in diameter!!!

A 20mm follicle would not even be considered "dominant", and would be as likely to regress as progress to ovulation with or without hCG...

Ovulation occurs in 36-42 hours after the hCG is given in around 80% of mares that receive hCG in the face of a 35 mm follicle.

WRT to breeding on consecutive days and if it will reduce the chances of conception - it can. If the mare has delayed uterine clearance issues, or a compromised uterine immune response, there will be a likelihood of reducing pregnancy rates. If the mare has a healthy uterus it will probably make little difference to the rates.

The discharge that you are seeing is perfectly normal post-breeding clearance of the fluids, which is good to see outside the mare, not left inside! :-)
 

Jan Owen
Breeding Stock
Username: 1frosty1

Post Number: 405
Registered: 04-2006
Posted on Sunday, June 24, 2007 - 01:54 am:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Kathy,

I have my fingers crossed for a success for you. I like you am not a breeder but a horse owner waiting for a foal from a beloved mare to have as a companion for the rest of his/her life. My repo vet breeds hundreds of mares each year and has told me that getting my mare pregnant was the most satisfying task and she too is anxiously awaiting the arrival of my foal. My mare is at 310 days. I really hope that your mare ovulated and she settles for you. Keep us posted. As always thanks Jos for you incredible knowledge.....
 

Kathy Simmons
Neonate
Username: Tuper

Post Number: 10
Registered: 06-2007
Posted on Monday, June 25, 2007 - 01:09 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

We are back home now!

JOS - Thank you so much for the information! I am pretty sure my mare is maiden (she's 11) so I don't have any reproduction history on her to know if she has any issues or not. But it is good to know that if she doesn't settle, I can look into something like that. (And also good to know that the discharge is normal and a good thing!)

Jan - Thanks for the good vibes! I will take all I can get! If she doesn't settle, I might try again next year......but probably not. Good luck to you on your mare's upcomming foaling! I watched my best friend's mare foal last July, and it was SUCH an emotional thing! We were crying and hugging....and the resulting colt is an absolutely amazing yearling now. I wish you lots of success!!

Yesterday they talked me into covering my mare again. Things went about like they did the day before, except she ended up with a little tear on the outside of her vulva. It wasn't bad at all, but I cried. I honestly feel really guilty putting her through this! (Don't I sound goofy as all heck?) She is 100% fine today, REALLY glad to be home. My gelding was MAD last night when she got back though! He could smell the stud on her I guess and he herded her off in a fit! He is top gelding and she is top mare in the pasture, so they usually have an understanding. It was just really interesting to see the interaction. (Don't worry, she's not in danger from him, he's not aggressive like that.)

When is the best time to take her in for the utrasound? I have heard different things. And do I count days from the last time she was covered? I will definitely keep you guys updated.....thanks SO MUCH for the support!!
 

Sheila Armstrong
Nursing Foal
Username: Sheila_armstrong

Post Number: 17
Registered: 05-2007
Posted on Monday, June 25, 2007 - 01:28 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Jos,

What if you have a mare that ovulates small follicles? I have a mare that had a 36 mm follicle two cycles ago and ovulated by the time she was checked the next day. Same thing happened with a 32 the following cycle. We missed ordering on both of those cycles because she ovulated by the day we intended to order. This time she was inseminated when she reached 31, and she got a shot of HCG.

Thank you,
Sheila
 

Jos
Board Administrator
Username: Admin

Post Number: 1391
Registered: 10-1999
Posted on Monday, June 25, 2007 - 07:14 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Kathy: Check out the article about twinning it will give you information about timing of ultrasounding.

Sheila: hCG will not work reliably until a 35 mm follicle is present, so in a mare that ovulates on smaller follicles, it's not much use. Deslorelin may be of value though as it can be used once a follicle is 30 mm in diameter - although if she is going to ovulate rapidly there probably isn't much point in using anything!
 

Kathy Simmons
Nursing Foal
Username: Tuper

Post Number: 18
Registered: 06-2007
Posted on Friday, July 13, 2007 - 05:18 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Just a quick update to let everyone know that my mare took!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I do another ultrasound between day 45-60 according to the vet. Any opinions as to which time is better?

I'm so excited!!!!! Thanks again so much for all your advice!
 

cathy Cook
Breeding Stock
Username: Razmacat

Post Number: 294
Registered: 08-2005
Posted on Friday, July 13, 2007 - 09:08 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I ultrasound at 15 and 28 days and then just palpate at 48 days.
 

Jan Owen
Breeding Stock
Username: 1frosty1

Post Number: 460
Registered: 04-2006
Posted on Friday, July 13, 2007 - 09:44 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Kathy,

I am so EXCITED for you! What an exciting year ahead as you anticipate your beloved foal! I too ultrasounded at 15 days to check for pregnancy and 28 days for a heartbeat and then palpated and then left alone:-)

Keep us posted as you go along.

My mare is on day 329 so getting closer:-)
 

Tina Todd
Neonate
Username: Tina_todd

Post Number: 3
Registered: 08-2007
Posted on Thursday, August 02, 2007 - 10:01 am:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Yaaaaaaay Kathy!!! I'm extremely excited for you also!!! You sound like me! lol I'm worrying already and my beloved mare will not be bred until spring 2008. hahaha I'm doing AI though and this will be my first experience breeding period! I worry about my baby girl as it is, never mind when we start this new adventure! lol Heck, I'm struggling with finding the right stallion for her. PLEASE keep this thread going so that I can monitor how and when you are doing things. I'm so much looking forward to talking with all of the vetrans here, your advice is extremely valuable. Thanks everyone!
 

Laurie A Beltran
Neonate
Username: Prophecy_ranch

Post Number: 5
Registered: 07-2007
Posted on Sunday, August 05, 2007 - 11:06 am:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Kathy, How wonderful and exciting for you! That's the kind of broodmare a breeder dies for....The type that gets covered 1 or 2x's and thats that!!!!Good luck keep us posted on her progress....I am in the waiting game mode, Lalique gets U.S in 3 weeks this was her 3rd covered. This cover you can't get any better. We bred her with hours of her ovualating! Keep your fingers crossed!.... This was my last try!
 

Jan Owen
Breeding Stock
Username: 1frosty1

Post Number: 544
Registered: 04-2006
Posted on Sunday, August 05, 2007 - 11:21 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Laurie,

Got my fingers and toes crosed for your Lalique..I know how bad you want this pregnancy. ...Keep us posted! Last August I was in your shoes waiting and on July 20th my baby was born! 3 times was the charm for my mare.
 

Tina Todd
Nursing Foal
Username: Tina_todd

Post Number: 15
Registered: 08-2007
Posted on Monday, August 06, 2007 - 08:19 am:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Good luck Laurie, everything is crossed and I'm sitting tight! It sounds like your timing is bang on. Please be sure to let us know okay?!
Boy, I wish I was in your shoes right now, I have to wait until next spring.
 

Heather Cooke
Weanling
Username: Hcvideo

Post Number: 37
Registered: 05-2007
Posted on Monday, August 06, 2007 - 04:39 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Breeding TBs is alot different than most breeds, there is no collecting, extending, cooling or freezing and using the semen on multiple mares. If the stallion is a busy fellow you get one shot at it for the heat cycle.
I breed pony hunters, it really does not matter what time of the year the foal is born. I believe most TB breeder consider there breeding season is Feb. to May, at the latest. Most of us aren't getting our ducks in a row until April. That's a lot of mares for the TB stallion manager to deal with in a short period of time and it is up to the mare managers to make it all work.
I'm very impressed with Cathy's mare management skills and very envious of her availiblity of GOOD Vets. Just think how much trouble it is for us to get 2 or 3 mares infoal every year. Cathy, my hat is off to you and your farm crew and I very much appreciate the knowledge, time and effort you put into this board.



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