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Please HELP having huge dramas getting my mare in foal.

Equine-Reproduction.com Bulletin Board » Breeding Problem Mares - Volume 2 » Please HELP having huge dramas getting my mare in foal. « Previous Next »


Author Message
 

kristen meyers
Neonate
Username: Krisjm83

Post Number: 1
Registered: 03-2010
Posted on Wednesday, March 24, 2010 - 06:26 am:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hi,
I joined this site because i have read many comments other people have been posting, i thought someone may be able to help me.
I have a nearly 17 yr old stockhorse mare who has never been put in foal until late last year when i started to try.
I had my vet do a check o her and she did, my mare was right to go. I bred her had her scanned 3 weeks later no pregnancy so we flushed her just in case, she was then given IM shots of oxytocin to help remove the fluid.
I then gave her estramate to bring her into season again later, this worked and she was bred again. I had her checked again and no foal. Tried again, nothing. So i had her given a antibiotic into the uterus, then another course of oxytocin. When this was done the vet said there was a large follicle becoming dominant and she should cycle in a week ( she should of been 20 days preg if in foal this time).
She was taken to the stallion daily and she didnt cycle and got quite annoyed with him started to become nasty. I tried and tried and still not cycling. I went to take her out of her paddock one day and she bit me she ment business and she has never in all her yrs done this before, or been nasty to the stallion.
So i rang the vet who is my boss and told her and asked if she may of missed the preg at 13 days and could she be preg? So we agreed to rescan her at 33 days and check again.
This we did and the the vet still couldnt see a pregnancy. But is 13 days she had developed a cystic follicle.
She has not come into season again at all since she was last bred. I spoke to another vet who told me that this follicle becoming cystic should not of appeared that quick-from becoming dominant to a large cyst in 13 days. They also told me it shouldnt stop her cycling. They told me if she hasnt cycled again it does sound like it isnt a cystic ovary they think she may be in foal.
My vet told me it would go away itself and i couldnt breed her this year again because she wouldnt go in foal.

What can i do i think i have done everything she has been cleaned out, antibiotic given internally and via IM, oxytoxin given, estramate given and so on. Is it possible she is preg? And if so could a pregnancy be mistaken for a cystic follicle at about 33 days?
She still ahsnt come back on and would now if in foal be 40 days.
Please help im alittle bit confused.
Thanks!
 

kristen meyers
Neonate
Username: Krisjm83

Post Number: 2
Registered: 03-2010
Posted on Wednesday, March 24, 2010 - 06:27 am:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Sorry forgot to say the mare is in otherwise prime health and very good condition.
 

Jos
Board Administrator
Username: Admin

Post Number: 2772
Registered: 10-1999
Posted on Wednesday, March 24, 2010 - 05:12 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

There are certain warning bells ringing here:
  • Mares do not develop cystic follicles. Those are found in the cow but not the mare;
  • Intrauterine treatment with an antibiotic in absence of an identified pathogen is risky at best and can be damaging at worst, resulting in an opportunistic pathogenic infection of the uterus;
  • Mares develop mid-cycle follicles, so in the absence of other signs (i.e. relying only on follicular presence) the presence of a "developing follicle" would not be reliable indicator of the impending onset of estrus;
  • Pregnant mares commonly develop follicles around 20 days of pregnancy - the presence or absence of them means nothing (i.e. does not indicate pregnancy or absence of pregnancy);
  • If an intrauterine infusion was used after she had been bred and identified "not in foal", it should (a) only have been performed when the mare was in estrus ("heat") so that the cervix was open allowing drainage; and (b) would in all likelihood have destroyed any pregnancy that was there if there had been one;
  • If the structure that has been "identified" as a "cystic follicle" was in fact an anovulatory hemorrhagic follicle it could indeed have gone from being a large follicle to hemorrhagic in the matter of 13 days (follow that link for more details on AHF's).
Overall, I think you would be well advised to (a) have the mare checked for pregnancy and (b) if not pregnant get a thorough work-up and breeding work performed by an expert in equine reproduction, preferably an equine theriogenologist.
 

kristen meyers
Neonate
Username: Krisjm83

Post Number: 3
Registered: 03-2010
Posted on Thursday, March 25, 2010 - 04:15 am:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hi,
I checked some of her notes at work today. Found that when she was given the antibiotic internally she was given 20mls of depocillin. The mare was not cycling at the time. This was when i was told that a follicle was becoming dominant and she should cycle in a week.
AT this time the follicle measured 2.5cms
This mare as stated has still not cyled again and should of been 33 days at the time when i had her checked again last week.
Notes say cystic right ovary - not in foal. Owner not mating again this season.

So sorry i must have been wrong about the cystic follicle. She must of said cystic ovary.
Does this make any difference.
Mare has still not cycled.
As said above, i do think if she was pregnant the antibiotic would of destroyed it.
Could doing bloods again now tell me anything more?
 

Jos
Board Administrator
Username: Admin

Post Number: 2774
Registered: 10-1999
Posted on Thursday, March 25, 2010 - 10:53 am:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

  • As noted above, intrauterine treatments during diestrus are less than ideal;
  • A 2.5 cm follicle is not considered a "dominant follicle";
  • While a cyst may be found on an ovary, it would be unlikely to interfere with cycling although it might interfere with conception if it were located in the region of the ovulation fossa, thereby preventing transport of the oocyte to the oviduct (my guess is that the reference was to the erroneous "cystic follicle");
  • Pregnant mares may develop structures that are similar to AHF's;
  • Non-pregnant mares may develop AHF's that can prevent estrus (as noted in the article I sent you to above);
  • The earliest that blood work can be performed to gain indication of pregnancy status is 45 days, and that is for eCG (PMSG) which could still remain elevated even in the case of a lost pregnancy (i.e. false positive), so not much use;
  • Warning bells are still ringing. I still follow my recommendation above.
 

kristen meyers
Neonate
Username: Krisjm83

Post Number: 4
Registered: 03-2010
Posted on Friday, March 26, 2010 - 06:57 am:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Will do Jos thanks!



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