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Torn when at stud now appears to have an infection??

Equine-Reproduction.com Bulletin Board » Breeding Problem Mares - Volume 2 » Torn when at stud now appears to have an infection?? « Previous Next »


Author Message
 

mel
Neonate
Username: Guisburn

Post Number: 1
Registered: 07-2007
Posted on Tuesday, July 10, 2007 - 03:44 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Picked up our maiden mare up 3 days ago from stud, where she had gone to be AI'd as she did not like our stallion. Stud advised me that they had covered her naturally 4 times! but that she had had a tear in her hymen which the vet had flushed her out with AB's and given her an injection.

The mare seemed subdued, but we put that to being covered for the first time, and there was no sign of trauma around her vagina, there was a whiteish discharge which I assumed was the Antibiotic flush. She is now still 'off' colour and tonight I noticed some yellow mucus discharge from her vagina, it is not smelly, but as she is not herself i will get the vet to her in the morning - any ideas, an infection in an internal tear.....??
 

Jos
Board Administrator
Username: Admin

Post Number: 1431
Registered: 10-1999
Posted on Tuesday, July 10, 2007 - 10:18 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Think about this... it would be hard to breed a mare without tearing the hymen!!!! :-)

If there is a tear that is causing problems it must be in the vaginal wall or the cervix. It might conceivably be in the uterus, but that is unlikely and would probably have evidenced more of problem prior to now.

You are right to have the vet check her.
 

mel
Neonate
Username: Guisburn

Post Number: 2
Registered: 07-2007
Posted on Thursday, July 12, 2007 - 03:38 am:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hi Jos - being a lady, I too found the 'hymen' explaination, strange to say the least, but checked her behind and saw no obvious trauma (where you would expect)
She has come back from the vet who confirm a large internal tear, but could not scan/internal her due to the discomfort (she was covered 4 times?)- she is now on anitbiotics and bute for the next 5 days, we have just given her a second injection, and she looks a little brighter - I assume that we will be unlikely to have a foal from this covering. Is this likely to affect her future as a brood mare, as I was informed that her sire was destroyed this week, which makes her quite rare.
 

Jos
Board Administrator
Username: Admin

Post Number: 1433
Registered: 10-1999
Posted on Thursday, July 12, 2007 - 12:11 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Without knowing the exact position and extent of the tear it is really impossile to say what future reproductive efficiency - or come to that the outcome of this breeding - is likely to be.

If the tear is in the cervix, then you are quite possibly in trouble. If it's in the vaginal wall than it will probably heal with little or not trouble - keep an eye out for abcesses.

You will need to have a reproductive examination performed prior to future breedings - but don't rule out the possibility of pregnancy on this cycle either.

AI really is nicer for all concerned... :-)
 

E Watkins
Breeding Stock
Username: Ev_watkins

Post Number: 222
Registered: 03-2007
Posted on Thursday, July 12, 2007 - 03:01 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Mel- sorry to hear of your difficulty and I'm particularly sorry to hear what your mare has been thru. I hope she heals soon and that she is able to have foals in the future. We've had a couple of stallions that have been rough so I can just imagine what the poor thing went through.. Best of luck with her. Ev
 

mel
Neonate
Username: Guisburn

Post Number: 3
Registered: 07-2007
Posted on Sunday, July 22, 2007 - 01:25 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Thanks - Unfortunately our mare has gone back over today. Shivering, though temperature only 1 degree above normal. She looked to have a lot of discomfort moving her bowel with only one or two small poos at a time with obvious discomfort, and wanting to lie down. Rang the emergency vet number (Sunday on this side of the pond-so not the done thing) He wanted her straight to the surgery.
She is has so much imflamation that it was very difficult to perform any rectal examination.

Our vet had examined her at the stud, as he is also their local vet, he says that it is unusual to have 'pelvic disease' when there was no perforation of the vagina, which he advises there was not on this occassion, but confirmed that she had a tear above the cerix and at 4 0'clock below the cervix.

Her bowel and possibly bladder are being restricted due to the swelling. I have had no choice but to leave her at the hospital for anti-inflam' treatment, they are to keep her on a laxative diet (she was out on grass since she came home) and observation.
I have looked in all my vet books, and are alarmed to see these symptons described as 'peritonitis' and possibly fatal - having thought we had treat the infection, how bad could this be?????
 

Cathy
Breeding Stock
Username: Cathy

Post Number: 257
Registered: 04-2005
Posted on Monday, July 23, 2007 - 12:40 am:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)



If she was there to be AI'd can they explain in any way why she was live covered?

This would be a HUGE problem for me.
 

mel
Neonate
Username: Guisburn

Post Number: 4
Registered: 07-2007
Posted on Monday, July 23, 2007 - 04:10 am:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

When we booked her for AI we were requested to bring her up to the stud as they were not certain that they would have a mare in season, and needed to collect from the stallion. In all fairness they did say that she may stand for the stallion and if so they may cover her naturally.
Apparantly she was twitched for the first covering and then stood after that - she was covered 4 times.
 

Deborah Bills
Weanling
Username: Jinty123

Post Number: 29
Registered: 07-2007
Posted on Monday, July 23, 2007 - 07:17 am:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Mel, just reading up on your story. I feel so sorry for you and your mare. It must be really worrying for you. Have they said what the possibility is of having a foal this time round. At least you may have something to show for the grief you have had. I will keep my fingers crossed for you and the mare that all will be well. Best of luck. Debbie.
 

Jan Owen
Breeding Stock
Username: 1frosty1

Post Number: 476
Registered: 04-2006
Posted on Monday, July 23, 2007 - 05:48 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Yikes Mel,

I am so sorry for your poor mare and you. What a nightmare. Praying for a good recovery of you both. Hopefully she will get past this. What a mess. You are in my prayers.
Jan
 

mel
Neonate
Username: Guisburn

Post Number: 5
Registered: 07-2007
Posted on Tuesday, July 24, 2007 - 04:48 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Thanks everyone, visited her at the vets today, she seemed bright enough - no food or poo in her stable though. Spoke to the vet and he says she moved her bowels properly last night so he is pleased with her, wont be able to consider scanning to see if she is infoal until/if the inflamation subsides - Thanks everyone, she really is a pet, (and my other halfs favorite mare) - Mel
 

E Watkins
Breeding Stock
Username: Ev_watkins

Post Number: 224
Registered: 03-2007
Posted on Wednesday, July 25, 2007 - 01:10 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Mel- thanks for the update, I don't often post but have kept up with the saga of your mare's experience. I do believe that I would forward the vet bills to the breeder. I hope your mare recovers fully.. good luck, Ev
 

Jan Owen
Breeding Stock
Username: 1frosty1

Post Number: 494
Registered: 04-2006
Posted on Wednesday, July 25, 2007 - 04:21 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Ev...How are the two fillies doing? Have you decided to keep one over the other?
 

mel
Neonate
Username: Guisburn

Post Number: 6
Registered: 07-2007
Posted on Sunday, July 29, 2007 - 04:18 am:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Thanks Ev & everyone
She has been home now for 2 days, she is not allowed hay or to go out on grass as she is too swollen inside. We have split her feed into 4 a day of bran/sugar beet and a few oats, with 2 sachets of anit-biotics a day mixed in, we have also put a bit of oil into the feed to make it easier for her to pass. In these 2 days she has passed less than a third of a bucket of muck!?! She is loosing weight everyday, and I am wondering has anyone had a mare recover from pelvic disease/peritonis caused by internal injuries whilst at stud?
[URL=http://img338.imageshack.us/my.php?image=0002655jg1.jpg][IMG]'Coming home'
Mel
 

Marilyn Lemke
Weanling
Username: Marilyn_l

Post Number: 45
Registered: 06-2007
Posted on Sunday, July 29, 2007 - 08:42 am:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Mel, I'm sorry I don't have anything to add as far as help for your situation, I'm hoping someone here can give you more insight. I've been following your situation and it makes me so sad to see what your mare has gone through and is presently going through. It breaks my heart to see you going through this also.

Breeding is such a scary thing at times. Many problems can occur and does at times. I'm still trying to get my two mares bred this year and it's getting exhausting, not to mention expensive. But when I see that little foal laying beside the mother, it will all be worth every worry and every dollar I've spent.

Hang in there, with a little luck and a lot of prayers, she will get through this. I just want you to know that I'm very concerned and hope this gets resolved very soon.

By the way, your mare is beautiful.
Marilyn
 

Jan Owen
Breeding Stock
Username: 1frosty1

Post Number: 500
Registered: 04-2006
Posted on Sunday, July 29, 2007 - 11:45 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Dear Mel,

I am so sorry for all that you and your mare have had to go through. Heartbreaker! I am glad she was well enough to come home and hopefully being in familiar surroundings and surrounded by those who love her she will mend. It is good that at least she is eating and some is coming out. She can always put weight back on when she is better. My thoughts and prayers are with you. Please keep us updated...

Thinking of you!

Jan
 

mel
Neonate
Username: Guisburn

Post Number: 7
Registered: 07-2007
Posted on Sunday, August 05, 2007 - 06:25 am:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hi
Thanks for everyones thoughts and experience - Meerha is having a little pick of grass each day, we worried yesterday that she may be starting with laminitis as her hooves were unusually hot, with one hind leg swollen to the hock - I suppose this could be a problem with the illness that she has had?? I did experience this with toxins in the blood with a mare many years ago that did not cleanse properly - not nice! Anyway took her off the paddock into a woodchip coral area and gave her a bran mash with a little flowers of sulphur to flush her. By tea time her hooves were cool again, leg still swollen a little, but we will keep monitoring her!

thanks again everyone
Melanie
 

Tina Todd
Nursing Foal
Username: Tina_todd

Post Number: 13
Registered: 08-2007
Posted on Sunday, August 05, 2007 - 09:00 am:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I'm very sorry to hear what your poor mare has gone through Mel. However I must say this, please accept my apologies in advance as this is not intended to hurt feelings or bash. I'm sorry but what I have a problem with is when there are alternate ways of breeding i.e AI, why do people insist on putting horses through such unnecessary trauma, stress, that can also possibly lead to an illness or worse? Is it that live cover is cheaper? That may be so, then again when you start to add up your vet bills I would say the equation doesn't quite balance out. I truly hope that your mare fully recovers and that if you should try to breed her again, consider using AI and don't leave your mare unattended with the stallion owner if they can't be trusted to follow your orders. Remember that YOU call the shots not the breeder. They would definitely be paying the vet bills if indeed you did not agree to live cover under any circumstance.
 

mel
Neonate
Username: Guisburn

Post Number: 8
Registered: 07-2007
Posted on Sunday, August 05, 2007 - 12:11 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hi Tina
No offence taken, but if you read the begining of the post, the mare was intended to be AI'd - The reason being that we want to put our maiden mare through a stressful covering. We have a lovely stallion by the straight egyptian stallion Crusader of our own, but, he is 'very vocal' and she just didn't want to go within 4 feet of his stable, so we didnt force her.

We have a good local vet, who does AI, and a nearby stud with a very good partbred arab hack Champion would could collect fresh semen - The problem arose as the stud did not have a mare in season, and therefore her presence was requested to enable the stallion to be collected. In fairness to the stud, they did say that the stallion was quiet, and if she would stand she could possibily have a natural covering. At the end of the day the mare was covered naturally .....

I was told many years ago that the covering of a maiden mare could make or spoil her as a broodmare for the rest of her life it is that important.
She will be scanned for any problems early in the new year, before we would consider trying her again - Whether it would be a natural covering, I wouldnt like to say, at this moment I would settle for a mare this is fit and well.

All the best
Melanie
 

Tina Todd
Nursing Foal
Username: Tina_todd

Post Number: 14
Registered: 08-2007
Posted on Sunday, August 05, 2007 - 01:02 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I had read that your mare was intended to be AI'd the first time. So what I'm wondering is if this is the case why was she covered 4 times? I understand that you had to take your mare as he didn't have a mare in season in order for them to collect, but whether or not the stallion owner said the stallion was quiet or otherwise and if your mare would stand she could possibly have a natural live covering, when she was originally set up for AI, why was she covered at all never mind 4 times? I'm just confused that's all. Unless you gave him permission to do this and you haven't mentioned that part of this in your posts. There is no "problem that arose" here on the breeders end of things,the resolution to that particular problem is you take your mare, the breeder collects, you follow through with the AI, I just don't get this that's all. Just because the mare is at the stallions barn doesn't mean you can't do AI, so yes I'm somewhat stumped on this one and how the mare ended up in this postion. I'm equally stumped as to how and when the breeder decides at the end of the day how someone else's mare will be bred. I feel for you Mel, you are a better person than I am because he would probably find himself in court over this if it were my mare. The mare's owner makes the decisions not the stallion owner. All the best to your girl.

(Message edited by tina_todd on August 05, 2007)
 

E Watkins
Breeding Stock
Username: Ev_watkins

Post Number: 229
Registered: 03-2007
Posted on Monday, August 06, 2007 - 11:39 am:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Mel- keep up the fight on that mare, she sounds like she's still trying to heal, what a senseless thing to have to endure though. I hope that she starts to improve soon. ( and I have to agree with Tina on her comments, if this were my mare, I'd be all over that breeder. Costs for your girl's care have to be adding up and ultimately she may never be able to breed or may not live. I would hold them responsible, you entrusted your mare to them to breed her safely and responsibly, while accidents can happen, it sounds more like a case of carelessness on their part in how they handled her breeding ). I sure hope she pulls thru for you.. good luck. Ev

Jan- the FILLY is doing fine, she's gained weight and is looking much better. I sold the larger of the two already, made just about enough from that sale to pay for the one that I kept. I also bought a buckskin mare with very good breeding but she's a bit flighty, she's a work in progress. I hope to get her quietted down but I do believe it's going to be a challenge that I'm not certain I'm up to handling right now. Time will tell. Ev :-)
 

mel
Neonate
Username: Guisburn

Post Number: 9
Registered: 07-2007
Posted on Monday, August 06, 2007 - 04:07 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Thanks again again for everyones comments and good wishes - Our mare is making steady progress and is moving her bowels properly for the passed 2 days - we hope to start moving her onto more and more of her normal diet over the coming weeks
 

E Watkins
Breeding Stock
Username: Ev_watkins

Post Number: 230
Registered: 03-2007
Posted on Wednesday, August 08, 2007 - 02:08 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Mel- that is good news indeed, I hope that the forward progress continues, it sounds like you are indeed winning the battle. Ev



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