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Oxytocin- older mare use pre or post breeding

Equine-Reproduction.com Bulletin Board » Breeding Problem Mares - Volume 2 » Oxytocin- older mare use pre or post breeding « Previous Next »


Author Message
 

Beth Walker
Neonate
Username: Bbhorses

Post Number: 1
Registered: 01-2007
Posted on Wednesday, January 10, 2007 - 02:09 am:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I have a 20 yr old AQHA mare that has always been easy to get in foal, usually takes on first heat cycle. Her last foal was in 2005, tried to breed her in '06 with no luck. She would come into heat, breed her and she would come back into heat within 10 days of breeding her. Did live cover with one stallion, after 2nd failed attempt we A.I. with a different stallion still no luck. Cultures come back clean, ultrasound shows no signs of uterine fluid. I read about the oxytocin protocol on this site but was hoping someone could suggest whether she should be treated pre-breeding or post-breeding with the oxytocin. We would like to get one last foal out of this mare to keep since we have sold all her other foals, any help or suggestions are appreciated.
Thank You!
 

Jos
Board Administrator
Username: Admin

Post Number: 1134
Registered: 10-1999
Posted on Wednesday, January 10, 2007 - 02:30 am:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The fact that she is coming back into estrus within 10 days may be a cause for concern. This typically signifies that some uterine irritant (most commonly a pathogen) is causing premature prostaglandin release, which is what is causing her to return to estrus early. Was there a cytology smear prepared in conjunction with the culture? Read the article on this web site about the importance of the cytology smear (follow that link for the article). If you want to step up the diagnostics a little more (which might not be a bad idea) you could go with a uterine (endometrial) biopsy and culture.

As far as the oxytocin protocol is concerned, we will typically use this in older mares only post-breeding if there is not uterine fluid present pre-breeding, although in some of the more difficult mares, we have been successful in using it both pre- and post-breeding in the absence of the fluid (successful in that we got a pregnancy - which may or may not have been due to the extra oxytocin treatment!). It is a natural hormone, and it is cheap, so it is certainly worth giving it a go! :-)
 

Beth Walker
Neonate
Username: Bbhorses

Post Number: 2
Registered: 01-2007
Posted on Wednesday, January 10, 2007 - 02:52 am:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Thank you Jos for your quick response. My vet did not do a cytology smear with the culture. I will have him back out to take care of that. My vet had mentioned something about using "regumate' on her but I disagree with using it on her since she has never had problems getting or staying in foal until this past year. Could it be possible at 20 yrs old that she is no longer fertile enough to get in foal?
 

Betty Ann Sullivan
Neonate
Username: Spottedbutts

Post Number: 4
Registered: 07-2006
Posted on Monday, April 16, 2007 - 02:06 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I have a 12 year old mare with an unsuccessful repro history. Background on the mare: She was confirmed in foal at 45 days on her maiden breeding (IA) but absorbed/aborted. The next year (IA) she redbagged three weeks early and the filly died. She was left open the following few years. I have bred her the past two years, both IA and live cover with no conception. My vet is my neighbor and we have wore a path taking this mare to her clinic. She is cultured clean, ultrasounded for follicle and ovulation. Regumate didnt help. Histopathologic diagnosis of a recent biopsy was ENDOMETRIUM: marked edema. I spoke with the pathologist that performed the test and he said that this could be from the procedure itself or due to her being in estrus. He said her results were not typical of an infertile mare. What would be the best way to address this issue?
 

Jos
Board Administrator
Username: Admin

Post Number: 1263
Registered: 10-1999
Posted on Saturday, April 28, 2007 - 12:46 am:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

What was the biopsy score? What other observations were made? Have you attempted the use of an oxytocin protocol during breeding? (Follow that link for more information).
 

Betty Ann Sullivan
Neonate
Username: Spottedbutts

Post Number: 5
Registered: 07-2006
Posted on Thursday, May 03, 2007 - 12:45 am:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

There was no score and I questioned the pathologist about it. He said he couldnt score her normal do to the edema, but wouldnt score her as abnormal without knowing the reason for it. I have not tried the oxytocin protocol but would like to try it. Thank you
 

Beverly
Neonate
Username: Iluvhorses

Post Number: 2
Registered: 04-2007
Posted on Thursday, May 03, 2007 - 05:14 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I have a 6 yr old mare that had a uterine infection. What would be your thoughts on why a young mare like this that only had one foal couldn't clear it? She had a Staph infection. Last fall when she was cultured the vet said she was clean then this spring I had her cultured again but thought since she was clean last fall she surely would be this spring So I went ahead & had her bred. Vet came out after she was done breeding & infused her & I gave her oxytocin. What are the chances that one infusion would clear her up so she could get in foal & remain that way? Is Staph infections passed on to the stud? By the way she has good conformation back there. Any thoughts on tis would be appreciated
 

Jos
Board Administrator
Username: Admin

Post Number: 1282
Registered: 10-1999
Posted on Thursday, May 03, 2007 - 09:35 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The first thing to confirm was that it was indeed a pathogenic presence and not simply a {contaminant}. What did the cytology smear show? Without a cytology smear, the accuracy of a culture of a uterine swab is questionable at best (follow that link for more details).

Assuming it was a pathogen, then one should evaluate the mare's reproductive conformation. It may be that the mare is now "tipped" as a result of the previous foaling; or there could be any number of reasons as to why she ended up with an infection. Transmission of a Staphylococcal infection by the stallion is not one though - Staphylococcus is not an STD. If as you say she has good conformation, we are back once again to whether this was in fact a pathogenic presence, or merely a contaminant - 43% of swabs taken from the vagina (rather than the uterus) will identify an organism on culture, and about 31% of swabs from the uterus, but most of those will be contaminants rather than active pathogenic presence, hence the importance of the cytology smear.

Infusion with a suitable antibiotic to which the pathogen has shown sensitivity is the preferred treatment method. It is typical to infuse 3 times with the antibiotic - a single treatment is rarely adequate, and in fact may result in either a resistant organism or a superinfection.

Probably your best bet at this point is to hope it was indeed a contaminant, in which case no treatment was actually required, but the success rate will be higher...!
 

Beverly
Neonate
Username: Iluvhorses

Post Number: 4
Registered: 04-2007
Posted on Friday, May 04, 2007 - 06:31 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The vet has checked her uterus & ovaries & said everything looks or feels normal. She doesn't have the sunken anus like I have seen in mares with poor conformation. She was bred as a 3 yr old almost all summer long & never got in foal. I gave her a shot & took her back the next spring & she got in foal the first breeding. Then last spring when she foaled it was the same thing over bred her all summer & into the fall. I used the sire of the foal & I assumed maybe it was him since he was in his mid 20's & had small to hardly any testicles. Actually he looked almost like a gelding. So after several attempts with him & one breeding right when she was ready to ovulate that didn't work I switched studs. Bred her a couple times to him & still nothing so had her cultured & that one came back clean. She cultured her while she wasn't in heat & she also said her progestrone was low. I have since read that you can't get an accurate culture when they're not in heat & that an infection can cause low progestrone. The culture she done this spring was taken from her uterus & as far as the cytology I'm not sure but I do know it was sent off to the vet lab in blacksburg Va because I got back a report & it had Staph cohnii which I've never heard of that strain before...This has been the worst mare to get in foal that we've had since breeding for the last 10 yrs. Especially such a young mare. I had another mare that had an infection & was infused. She had staph treated that & done another culture & she then had strep so I wouldn't be suprised if this mare doesn't also develope a differnt one. THe difference is that other mare was 12 yrs old & had already produced 4 foals. This one really has me puzzled. One reason I didn't treat her more than the one time is because the vet said her cervix was starting to close & I just don't think they can get through enough to treat them properly. One other thing should the antibiotics eventually came back out or where does it go? Dont want to sound dumb but when the other mare was treated the vet said to walk her to keep it from coming back out & eventually she did have fluid come out. I never did see anything come back out of this mare.}
 

Beverly
Neonate
Username: Iluvhorses

Post Number: 5
Registered: 04-2007
Posted on Friday, May 04, 2007 - 06:44 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Just read the article on cytology. THe vet took the swab from the uterus using a swab inside a little pipette thing. Not sure what it's called. She then took it to the office & let it stand or whatever they do for 72 hours. She said it showed significant growth so she sent it off to the lab & then I got back the report of Staph cohnii...Also you stated that Staph is not a sexually transmitted disease but isn't it present on the mare & also the penis of the stallion & could therefore cause an infection that way? Could she have picked it up when she foaled? She passed the placenta before she ever stood up.
 

Jos
Board Administrator
Username: Admin

Post Number: 1284
Registered: 10-1999
Posted on Friday, May 04, 2007 - 09:02 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

It sounds as though there was not a cytology smear performed, so it is quite possible/likely that the organism is a contaminant. A contaminant is typically an environmental organism (i.e. as previously noted not from the stallion). Mares are highly susceptible to environmental organisms because of their reproductive structure, but those organisms do not necessarily represent a problem, and if the uterus was no mounting an inflammatory response (which is what the cytology smear would have told you), then it is likely not an issue.

I believe you (or someone else) recently posted a question about when to perform the uterine swab and if it was possible to do it during diestrus, and I have responded elsewhere on this board to that question in detail. Suffice to say here that you are wrong in your supposition that a swab cannot be successfully taken and read during diestrus (i.e. when the mare is not in "heat"). It can.

A single assay tells you nothing about progesterone profiles. Please read the article about Progestin supplementation that appears on this site (follow that link).

There also seems to be a serious management issue here as well... if the mare was bred repeatedly through several cycles (such as you indicate occurred in previous years) then the irritation of that breeding can be enough to cause endometritis and prevent pregnancy establishment. As a general rule, if a mare is bred unsuccessfully for 3 cycles, then it is going to be even harder to get her pregnant because of the irritation of the repeated breeding.

One final point - unless the vet failed to put an antibiotic infusion into the uterus (i.e. they put it into the vagina by mistake) there would be no reason to anticipate that the mare would "lose" the infusion and require walking immediately after. If that was indeed what your vet advised, you might want to consult another veterinarian that perhaps specialises in equine reproduction - preferably a Theriogenologist. It might be a little more expensive initially, but will probably be cheaper in the long run!
 

Beverly
Neonate
Username: Iluvhorses

Post Number: 6
Registered: 04-2007
Posted on Friday, May 04, 2007 - 10:14 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

When I said she was bred through the summer & fall I didn't mean every heat cycle. I just meant she was bred several times during that year....The first time she was bred as a 3 yr old maiden she didn't get in foal after several attempts..I would have thought being a maiden she would have got in foal easily..I guess the site I read about not getting an accurate result when culturing them when not in heat was misleading but I don't see how she could have been clean last fall & then turn up dirty this spring when she wasn't bred after the culture..I appreciate your response & I guess I shouldn't get my hopes up that she willl be in foal this time either.
 

Jos
Board Administrator
Username: Admin

Post Number: 1286
Registered: 10-1999
Posted on Saturday, May 05, 2007 - 10:55 am:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Maiden mares that have not been bred can be infected, so there is no correlation between breeding and infection as the sole cause. I have pointed out a couple of times that Staph. is not considered an STD - it has not originated from the stallion. It is an issue with the mare, but as you apparently did not have a cytology smear performed in conjunction with the culture, there is a pretty good chance it is going to turn out to be a contaminant.
 

Beverly
Neonate
Username: Iluvhorses

Post Number: 7
Registered: 04-2007
Posted on Sunday, May 06, 2007 - 11:54 am:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I guess I'm not understanding what a cytology smear is. The vet let it grow for 72 hours & then she sent it to a vet lab where they confirmed that it is Staph. What else could they do? Staph might not be a STD but isn't it present on the vulva of the mare & the stallions penis & could therefore be put in her uterus that way? THe only other way then if that's not how she got it is she either has pneumovagina (spelling) or she got it somehow when she foaled?
 

Jos
Board Administrator
Username: Admin

Post Number: 1287
Registered: 10-1999
Posted on Monday, May 07, 2007 - 04:58 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Please review the article that I cited above about cytology smears (follow that link).

What your vets are doing is a culture, but in order for that to provide accurate results there must be a cytology smear prepared and read of the swab as well, and the results of the cytology smear must support the findings of the culture. Please read the article - you'll (hopefully) understand it more afterwards.

Organisms are present in the mare's uterus on about 43% of swabs - and that includes maiden mares. Organisms gain access to any open aperture in the body without the need for something to take them in there, but it doesn't mean they are a problem - look how dirty the human mouth is, it's full of organisms, and yet one rarely developes an infection.
 

Beverly
Neonate
Username: Iluvhorses

Post Number: 8
Registered: 04-2007
Posted on Thursday, May 17, 2007 - 07:07 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I had the above mare that had the staph infection ultrasounded today & she IS in foal. I'm so happy after all the trouble we've had with her over the last 3 yrs. Also asked the vet about the cytology smear & there was one done.



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