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Water Volume for a Colorado AV

Equine-Reproduction.com Bulletin Board » Breeding Methods » Water Volume for a Colorado AV « Previous Next »


Author Message
 

Anne
Neonate
Username: Greenroom

Post Number: 1
Registered: 03-2006
Posted on Tuesday, March 07, 2006 - 04:33 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Can anyone tell me how many pounds of water would be a good starting point in filling a CO AV (22") for a stallion? We built our AV, heated the water to the "green zone" in temp (yes, it sat long enough to make sure there was no rise in heat) and had it filled with 24 pounds of water. He would work the phantom but did not ejaculate. When it was first filled, it was in excess of the 24 pounds and we let water out. He worked it more with the less amount of water, but are curious as to where we should go from here.
 

Danielle Roosen-Runge
Weanling
Username: Rolling_hills_quarter_horses

Post Number: 24
Registered: 09-2005
Posted on Tuesday, March 07, 2006 - 10:38 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Every stallion is different and temperature can have something to do with it as well. You are going to have to find the happy medium with temperature and firmness to make him happy. Has he been collected before?
 

Anne
Neonate
Username: Greenroom

Post Number: 2
Registered: 03-2006
Posted on Tuesday, March 07, 2006 - 11:12 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Yes, I'm very aware of the difference in volume and temp from stallion to stallion. He's been collected before, but not at our farm and we won't take him back to the place he was collected last year, hence my asking what would be considered a normal volume to start with.
 

Jos
Board Administrator
Username: Jos

Post Number: 10508
Registered: 10-1999
Posted on Tuesday, March 07, 2006 - 11:27 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

One cannot really provide a "standard" weight. It's going to vary too much. Not all Colorado AV's are manufactured by the same company, and even those that are have varied in basic weight from the older models to the newer ones. Additionally, if one has an old latex liner, it will be more relaxed than a newer one, and consequently require more water to get the same degree of tension as a new one.

It is generally considered best to start off by filling the AV and then displacing the amount of water deemed desirable for the individual stallion by estimating the approximate displacement that will occur with that particular stallions penis. Compare the erect penile size to the size of your arm, and use your arm in the AV (inside a rectal sleeve) to estimate the displacement, removing the required amount of water to get the desired tension.

Once you have done that, you can weigh the AV and get your starting point weight, but be aware - as I noted above - that as the latex liner relaxes with use, the weight will require adjustment to offset the relaxation.
 

Anne
Neonate
Username: Greenroom

Post Number: 3
Registered: 03-2006
Posted on Wednesday, March 08, 2006 - 11:38 am:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Jos,
I comprehend what your saying. Based on the fact that we released water and he was more willing to work the dummy, but still not ejaculate, what would you suggest needs to be looked at first? Amount of Lubrication, the temperature or the pressure (increase or decrease) in order to get him collected?
 

Jos
Board Administrator
Username: Jos

Post Number: 10512
Registered: 10-1999
Posted on Wednesday, March 08, 2006 - 11:58 am:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

In our travels around the country, we see a fair few of the "built-in AV breeding mounts". About 80% of them have the open end covered over and the stallion is collected by diverting the penis off to one side.

The idea of the "self-serve" mount is fine, but in reality it often (in fact it seems the majority of the time) doesn't work well.

One of the problems - which is what you appear to be encountering - is that if the stallion enters the AV and then won't thrust enough to gain sufficient stimulation, there really isn't a lot you can do to improve it... :-( (When collecting off the side, one can move the AV or manipulate the glans).

I would set the internal temperature of the AV to 54° C (130° F) and see if that helps - hotter AV's can be beneficial.

Do you use a tease mare, and if so where is she located during the collection attempt?

Give me some more details about your set-up and I'll see if I can make some more suggestions.
 

Anne
Neonate
Username: Greenroom

Post Number: 4
Registered: 03-2006
Posted on Wednesday, March 08, 2006 - 02:27 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

We do have a tease mare located just off the right side of the dummy and just out of reach. He will drop and mount the dummy w/out the use of mares too. He definatly thrusts a lot and we have the ability of collecting both ways, but prefer to have him be able to collect with only one person as my husband travels a lot of the time and I am home by myself. He was only collected a few times last year and did have sufficient volume and motility to split a collection and inseminate multiple mares. This year, we will have around 6 mares coming in to breed to him plus our own. We are going to try and collect him this afternoon, and will adjust the temp higher and see what we get there. Last year in the collections, they didn't have to move or manipulate anything to get an ejaculation from him, but did collect in an ARS Colorado AV (with a disposable liner and the water jacket was one that had been used quite a few times. The jacket we've got is brand new.

Fortunatly, he's very easy going with the dummy and not overly agressive (good only in the sense that he's cautious about those around him and very careful in where he places himself.



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