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Worming Questions

Equine-Reproduction.com Bulletin Board » Miscellaneous and Suggestions for a New Topic Category » Worming Questions « Previous Next »


Author Message
 

Kim Peavy/ Sweetie 7/3/08
Breeding Stock
Username: Lovemysinbad

Post Number: 164
Registered: 09-2007
Posted on Thursday, April 24, 2008 - 07:04 am:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Good morning all! I have (3) horses in Central Florida that I board at a facility. There is not alot of grass, but some, but very sandy soil. My horses are all pasture boarded so they are out 24/7. My trainer/owner of facility has been worming our horses every other month.

I've recently started using a vet at a very well known equine facility (nationially known) and she is telling me that they are discovering that we may not need to worm thru the summer months. She wants me to do a fecal count on my two geldings and if they come back clean or ok, we won't worm them again until September. My trainer/owner is just outraged at this. She says worms are most active here in the summer months and does not understand this logic. Anyone out there heard of this? I don't want to do anything to hurt my horses and definately want to trust my vet's opinion. The vet is saying that they are doing studies that show the horses are getting too much medication with all the worming and it makes it harder for other meds to work when they get sick, etc. My two horses are the only ones in our pasture at this time, but I cannot guarantee that others won't join them as they get in new boarders. Any advice you all may be able to offer is greatly appreciated, as I am approaching month two and time to worm, but I'm also taking the fecal sample in...thanks so much!
 

Heather Cooke
Breeding Stock
Username: Hcvideo

Post Number: 151
Registered: 05-2007
Posted on Thursday, April 24, 2008 - 08:53 am:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

If you had good pasture and your horses were not grazing close to the ground during the summer like they do in the fall/winter maybe there is something to what your vet says. It won't hurt to do a fecal check since it is at the 2 month mark. If your horses check out clean, I would be hard press to change the program. I understand what your vet is saying but I'd like to see more research done on someone elses horses, not mine.
Your barn owner doesn't want to take the chance of getting a parasite infestation, you should appreciate that.
 

Catherine Owen
Breeding Stock
Username: Cateowen

Post Number: 204
Registered: 12-2007
Posted on Thursday, April 24, 2008 - 08:58 am:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I'm AMAZED at such "advice". I live in South Carolina and have show friends in Florida. Florida is a climate where I would probably have my horses on daily dewormer in addition to the purge wormings. I know I do up here in South Carolina. Stuff NEVER dies down there (and for the most part here where I am at) and the eggs, larvae, etc. stay active year-round.

I'm with your boarding facility manager on this one. Particularly if your horses are going to be exposed to rotational traffic in and out of a boarding facility. They may be the only ones in the pasture now, but what about next month? I can definitely understand a boarding facility manager's viewpoint in keeping things wormed and up-to-date on shots, etc. To not worm a group of horses for about 6 months, particularly in Florida at a boarding facility ----I think you get the gist of my opinion.

I don't think a fecal count will hurt but keep in mind that only tells you what is in the horses manure that day. To say that "oh well, they are okay, don't worm until September again, based on a fecal count done in April" is, pardon my French, but not real smart, particularly in your part of the country at a boarding facility where horses are moving in and out.

I don't know about these "studies" that this vet is citing (i.e., were they done in FLORIDA or in the northwest corner of North Dakota where you have totally different set of circumstances regarding worms?; how many horses were in the control group? 10 or 100?) but I can show you lots of studies about bloodworms (strongyles) in particular down here in the Deep South that do tons of damage to horses heart, lungs, etc. And the larvae in the circulatory system doesn't get picked up in a fecal count.

You say this vet is new to you? Is he/she new to veterinary practice in general? Just curious because sometimes vets come out of school and of course have lots of "new" ideas. Which isn't bad but sometimes flys in the face of what is learned in everyday practice.
 

Kim Peavy/ Sweetie 7/3/08
Breeding Stock
Username: Lovemysinbad

Post Number: 165
Registered: 09-2007
Posted on Thursday, April 24, 2008 - 09:38 am:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Thanks Heather and Catherine. I appreciate your insight, since I've only been dealing with my own horses and their care for a year now, I just don't know what to do. My vet is new to me, but she's been practicing for awhile. SHe is one vet at Petersen & Smith Equine hospital and like I said they are very very well respected around here, but they also treat a whole lot of the TB farms around here...I'm just three horses she takes care of at this boarding facility...I'm afraid she may not be comparing apples to apples here with my horses. I really think I'm gonna stick with my every other month plan. I did have them on the preventicare program, but I kinda ran into the problem that I didn't feel they were getting their daily wormer "daily". My boarding facility was very sporadic about when they had me buy more wormer....so I really could not trust they were getting it like they should. I do trust my owner/trainer and she really thinks the vet is out there on this one, esp. for Florida and the setup we have right now....thanks again....I knew you guys would give me a direction to head Kim
 

Catherine Owen
Breeding Stock
Username: Cateowen

Post Number: 208
Registered: 12-2007
Posted on Thursday, April 24, 2008 - 10:32 am:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Kim,
Yes I would stick with at least a every two-month worming protocol here in the South.

I love living down here because of the weather, but we do have bug and worm problems that aren't encountered in other places of the country.
 

Heather Cooke
Breeding Stock
Username: Hcvideo

Post Number: 153
Registered: 05-2007
Posted on Thursday, April 24, 2008 - 12:51 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Kim
Where is the vet from, before coming to Petersen and Smith? Maybe she is not familar to life in Florida. I live near Gainesville, Fl. I have had vet that have move down here that were clueless with things like no-seeums, skin allerges, sand colic, dried cracked hoofs and worm all year long, just to mention a few. They have read about the problems but don't have the practical experience.
 

Kim Peavy/ Sweetie 7/3/08
Breeding Stock
Username: Lovemysinbad

Post Number: 166
Registered: 09-2007
Posted on Thursday, April 24, 2008 - 02:21 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Heather: I know she was born and raised in British Columbia, went to vet school in CA and finished her internship at Peterson & Smith in 2006 and stayed on as a vet....so who knows...I know they do a whole lot of studies at that place and like I said, if you know what horses are coming and going and they have nice pastures with good manure and pasture control, her plan may work, but not where we are...lots of sand, very little grass and the pastures do not get drug etc. very often. Not to mention, horses coming and going quite often. Also, my two do travel frequently for shows and things....but I'm really gonna quiz her on this and try to get a better understanding of where she is coming from....it is interesting to hear all the different sides to this...kim
 

Heather Cooke
Breeding Stock
Username: Hcvideo

Post Number: 154
Registered: 05-2007
Posted on Thursday, April 24, 2008 - 06:51 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hey Kim
Let us know what you find out. What other meds does she think the wormers have a negative effect on?
 

Kim Peavy/ Sweetie 7/3/08
Breeding Stock
Username: Lovemysinbad

Post Number: 167
Registered: 09-2007
Posted on Thursday, April 24, 2008 - 08:36 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I spoke with the vet this afternoon to get a better idea of what she is talking about...I also researched their website and found that the understanding is that the parasites cannot survive the heat in Florida. This is why they do a fecal sample in April, worm if necessary and then do not start worming again until September. The study has shown that worms cannot survive in this Florida heat. My horses are 24/7 pasture horses and are in the elements all day. She said she personally does not worm her horses from April thru September...never had a problem. I'm going to do some more research on this. Also Please Horse Journal forum, I asked some input there, so far the only response is, your vet is right, the worms cannot survive the Florida heat and therefore are not a problem during those months...anyone?
 

Kay B. Jones,Nova born 2/24
Breeding Stock
Username: Kaybjones

Post Number: 229
Registered: 03-2007
Posted on Thursday, April 24, 2008 - 09:11 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

For sand colic I give my older horses one heaping tablespoon of metamucil daily. Anyone know when I can use this regimen on my 8 week foal.
 

judy cervantes/chenoa born 3/30/08
Breeding Stock
Username: Judy1

Post Number: 368
Registered: 12-2007
Posted on Thursday, April 24, 2008 - 09:54 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

kay,i was just talking with my vet about sand colic and he told me about something called THE ASSURE SYSTEM ,he said it will eleminate 600% of sand out of the large intestine,if you want to read more on it go to www.equinecolic.org.
 

Catherine Owen
Breeding Stock
Username: Cateowen

Post Number: 212
Registered: 12-2007
Posted on Friday, April 25, 2008 - 09:31 am:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Kim,
Never heard of that theory (worms can't survive the heat). I'm sticking with my daily dewormer, particularly on my young horses where circulatory strongyles are such an issue. I know eggs and larvae are pretty "creative" and can survive a lot. Adult worms, maybe not, but I'm still skeptical. Keep in mind, horses don't eat the adult worms out in the pastures, its the eggs and larvae they pick up. Also you are at a boarding facility where the horses coming in could have anything in their systems and can pass it right along.
I'd rather be safe than have to deal with a colic caused by worm load.
 

Kim Peavy/ Sweetie 7/3/08
Breeding Stock
Username: Lovemysinbad

Post Number: 168
Registered: 09-2007
Posted on Friday, April 25, 2008 - 10:16 am:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Catherine....I know..it is just so darn frustrating and I know they are constantly doing studies and what not....what a dilemma....
 

Marilyn Lemke - Dora due 7/31/08
Senior Stallion or Mare
Username: Marilyn_l

Post Number: 1273
Registered: 06-2007
Posted on Friday, April 25, 2008 - 11:06 am:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Kim we're getting closer to foaling date. Yippeee! Yup, I'm still watching your posts to see how your mare is doing. You have only about two more months left, you lucky dog. But I'm right behind you. :-) How's she doing? Any new pictures of her and her preggo belly? Just curious how big she is right now.
 

Kim Peavy/ Sweetie 7/3/08
Breeding Stock
Username: Lovemysinbad

Post Number: 169
Registered: 09-2007
Posted on Friday, April 25, 2008 - 07:16 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hi Marilyn: Yes, find the thread June foal watch...I just posted some pix of her about a week ago....can you believe it's almost here...Sweetie is looking so good, just passed 270 day mark....wooohoooo

How's Dora? She must be getting bigger and I know she is looking all shiny with that prego glow...cannot wait to see her...
 

Kay B. Jones,Nova born 2/24
Breeding Stock
Username: Kaybjones

Post Number: 230
Registered: 03-2007
Posted on Saturday, April 26, 2008 - 09:55 am:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Mine graze with the cows. I suppose they can pick up worms there too even though no new horses come and go. We worm our cows but not near as often.
 

Kay B. Jones,Nova born 2/24
Breeding Stock
Username: Kaybjones

Post Number: 231
Registered: 03-2007
Posted on Saturday, April 26, 2008 - 10:02 am:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Judy , I looked at the Assure System- sounds really good, kinda pricey. I looked at the Assure Hoof because I know biotin linked with methionine works well for hooves.
 

judy cervantes/chenoa born 3/30/08
Breeding Stock
Username: Judy1

Post Number: 372
Registered: 12-2007
Posted on Saturday, April 26, 2008 - 02:15 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

KAY I THOUGHT THE SAME THING,LOOKS GOOD BUT COST TO MUCH FOR ME AT THIS TIME,.
 

Jenni Luttrell
Senior Stallion or Mare
Username: Bugrace2000

Post Number: 1018
Registered: 02-2007
Posted on Saturday, April 26, 2008 - 03:00 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Kay I have no clue about the logic behind this but I know several older cowboys that swear if you graze cattle with horses or right behind them in your pasture rotation you wont have a worm problem..
I dont have cows so I dont know.



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