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Terry
Posted From: 65.148.57.186
| | Posted on Saturday, January 15, 2005 - 01:43 am: | 
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I have a 13 year-old daughter who is interested in this stallion. He is a three year-old Arabian. My daughter has worked with horses all her life and has alot of experiance with stallions. The stallion I'm looking at is not trained to ride yet but is still well trained. We have a place to keep him but what kind of fencing is best? Could we turn him out with our gelding? Thanks for reading. All the onformation you could give me would help. |
Eagle View Arabians
Posted From: 205.188.116.13
| | Posted on Saturday, January 15, 2005 - 12:46 pm: |
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Terry, stallions are a lot of work but it your daughter has been around them and worked with them before she may be ok. I know you will probably get some negative feedback about this and everyone will have their own opinion. I also worked with a few TB stallions when I was around her age so I feel that it can be done safely. That said, I would recommend you have a professional trainer break and train this horse while working with your daughter so she can have a safe partnership. I keep my 3yr old Arabian Stallion in a 6 foot high wood fence with hot wire along the top and inside of the fence and he does get turned out with a gelding. No matter how well behaved he is, he is still young and has hormones!  Good luck, and keep us posted on what you decide to do. |
Terry
Posted From: 65.148.57.20
| | Posted on Saturday, January 15, 2005 - 02:40 pm: |
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The gelding I would turn him out with is a very dominent gelding. I sthat ok or should I use a differant horse to turn him out with? Would a five foot fence work? Thanks |
Terry
Posted From: 65.148.57.20
| | Posted on Saturday, January 15, 2005 - 02:44 pm: |
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If yoiu know alot about Arabians could you help me? This stallions sire is MS Rafiq. Is that really good? What disipline do you think Arabians excel at the most besides endurance? |
Eagle View Arabians
Posted From: 152.163.100.14
| | Posted on Sunday, January 16, 2005 - 12:35 pm: |
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Terry, the wonderful thing about Arabians are that they are so versatile. I ride mainly dressage but have also done huntseat and endurance. I also had a gelding that I did a little jumping with.
I think you would probably be fine with a 5 foot fence but I would put some hot wire up too. The gelding would probably be fine. I actually had my stallion turned out with a mare when he was younger that is pretty dominant. She put him in his place fast!
What is your daughter looking for? Does she eventually want to breed him or just ride? |
Terry
Posted From: 65.148.56.43
| | Posted on Sunday, January 16, 2005 - 07:22 pm: |
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She wants to do dressage and maybe some western events to. We have a few mares we would like to breed him to every other year or so. We would like to have a small barn where we breed half arabians, with our friend who has alot of breeding experiance. Could this work out? |
Eagle View Arabians
Posted From: 152.163.100.13
| | Posted on Monday, January 17, 2005 - 03:23 pm: |
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I breed purebred Arabians but I am a small breeder mainly for myself and a couple a foals every few years. I enjoy it and it's not about the money for me. I think if you have people helping you that have this experiance and you're doing it more for the love of the horse instead of money (breeding is NOT cheap!) you'll be fine. Keep us posted. |
Lori
| | Posted on Monday, January 17, 2005 - 06:06 pm: |
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I see no reason you could not give it a go, and if it doesn't work out, just get him gelded. If you really love the horse, you can choose if having a stallion is too hard to keep him and just SNIP the problem, if it becomes a problem at all! Z |
Applewood
Posted From: 12.145.186.69
| | Posted on Thursday, January 20, 2005 - 03:18 pm: |
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I would not buy a stallion for your 13 year old. Stallions are alot of work, but also alot of liability that you would be liable for. Also they are limited from showing in a lot of areas by anyone under 18. I think Arabs it's 16. Also public trail rides usual from on them. Also sometimes no matter how mature a child is they are still a child and lack judgement sometime and by the time they realize that there is a problem the child cannot turn off the stallion. I wouldn't let her keep him as a stallion Geld him right away.. or don't buy him. Speaking from a stallion owner, trainer and breeder, |
Eagle View Arabians
Posted From: 64.12.116.13
| | Posted on Thursday, January 20, 2005 - 11:29 pm: |
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Terry, told you that you would get some negative feedback! Applewood has some valid points but that's why I recommended you working with a trainer and not going about it all alone. The stallion also has a lot to do with it. I have dealt with studs that adults can barely handle and I've also worked with ones that were like kittens (even while breeding!) Just definitely have someone with experiance help you. |
Eagle View Arabians
Posted From: 64.12.116.13
| | Posted on Thursday, January 20, 2005 - 11:31 pm: |
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Also, like Z said, if it becomes a problem...geld him! |
applewood
Posted From: 12.145.186.69
| | Posted on Friday, January 28, 2005 - 03:42 pm: |
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Thank you, and Agreed. A stallion and a child must be supervised. My stallion is supersweet. No one really knows he's a stallion MOST of the time.. but it only takes one.. Plus from a kids point of view.. you kind of miss doing the fun stuff on a horse that you want to do as a kid. be a little reckless, and be a kid.. We have all done that.. When Eyes are away the mice will play.. its a fact of life... There is no room for that with a stallion.. Good luck I am just trying to be realistic make a check list of negative and positives, and Identify what you really want with this horse, and see if they match up./ |
Tx Breeder
Posted From: 199.3.209.118
| | Posted on Sunday, January 30, 2005 - 02:07 am: |
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I totally agree with applewood. There are so many good stallions and breeding operations, why open yourself up to a very real danger. Showing, training and even pleasure riding would be more enjoyable for horse and child if done with a gelding. If you wait until it becomes a problem, it may be something that has severe consequences.Consider the liabilities connected with owing a stallion. Visitors to your stables may not conduct themselves according to your instructions. Injuries could have a devestating effect on a personal level as well as legal. I urge you to reconsider. |
Liz Hardy
Posted From: 64.12.116.13
| | Posted on Monday, February 14, 2005 - 10:51 pm: |
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Sorry I am not for a 13yr old child no matter how knowledgeable getting a stallion for her own horse.. there are just too many things that can go wrong
Unless he is a stellar example of his breed he should be gelded. And really there are not that many stallions that qualify.
If you are truely interested in breeding.. hold off on buying a stallion til you know more about what you want and WHAT SELLS. Breed the mares you have to some top quality stallions.. it is cheaper than buying and standing your own.
Kids take risks and that is not something that can be allowed in handling and riding a stallion.
And in some venues children can not ride or show stallions
If she really likes thie horse give him to her as a gelding |
Eagle View Arabians
Posted From: 205.188.116.13
| | Posted on Monday, February 14, 2005 - 11:05 pm: |
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As I said in my original post, I recommend Terry's daughter working with a trainer and not going about it all alone. I agree that a 13 year old should not be allowed to have a stallion all on her own and be let loose with him to do as she pleases. When I was 13 I showed a TB stallion and handled him on a regular basis BUT I did it under the supervision of my dressage trainer. If Terry is planning on giving this stallion to her daughter and letting her do everything on her own then I do recommend not buying him or gelding him. It's all about responsibility! |
Anonymous
Posted From: 24.138.77.71
| | Posted on Thursday, February 24, 2005 - 04:32 pm: |
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I am 15 yrs old amd I have a stallion. I started riding stallions when I was 13 and got my own when I was 14. He was sooo bad and hard to handle that even professionals could not work with him. I spent many hours a day working with him and he is now very gentle and well behaved. People always comment on how well mannered he is and that they cannot believe he is a stallion. I had help from my coach and from Jos but I did most of it myself. I used to not be able to ride him with other horses now I hack with mares in full heat and he hardly looks at them. I ride him bareback with a halter and leadline but I always remember that he is a stallion and I know what he can do when he wants to. I cannot see why not try buying the horse. |
Anonymous
Posted From: 152.163.100.13
| | Posted on Friday, February 25, 2005 - 07:19 pm: |
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Sorry I would not want my daughter riding her mare with you.... It is not so much whether you can control your stallion as much as other kids controlling their horse too..
Sorry Stallions are breeding animals if you as an owner are not using them to breed than they need to be gelded.. It is awfully frustrating not to be able to do what nature intended... |
Anonymous
Posted From: 152.163.100.13
| | Posted on Friday, February 25, 2005 - 07:26 pm: |
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Oh and one more thing on Breeding... a Breeding Stallion better be a Stellar example of his breed or he should be gelded.. Period.. there are too many substandard medorce stallions out there.
And there are just plain too many horses of any standard.. suggesting that less breeding is needed and more homes are needed
And if you want proof just look at all the horses that end up in the slaughter pens and not all are sick and crippled or dangerous... ... suggesting far fewer foals need to be made |
TX Breeder
Posted From: 199.3.209.56
| | Posted on Saturday, February 26, 2005 - 05:43 pm: |
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Just because a person has had an experience with one well behaved stallion is no reason to assume that stallions are suitable for adults much less children. There are plenty of well known, professional horsemen that are not prepared to handle a stallion.
It only takes one bad situation, and horrible consequences could occur. Stallions attitudes change from year to year,depending on if they are or are not breeding stallions.I have seen many "sweet" colts turn into bad actors for any number of reasons. Having over 10 stallions on my premises, I can assure you that I know what I am talking about. It is only a matter of "when" not "if" nature kicks in.
As the previous post points out, there is no reason is have a stallion unless you are a qualified breeder whith outstanding bloodlines. I find that ego is usually the culprit, when such sound advice is discounted. |
Eagle View Arabians
Posted From: 205.188.116.13
| | Posted on Sunday, February 27, 2005 - 03:51 pm: |
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I think we could get in to a discussion all week long on what makes a stallion breeding quality. I agree that there are too many stallions out there and people like to own them just to say they have a stallion. I breed Arabians, many people have nothing good to say about this breed because too many "back yard breeder's" have over populated and bred crappy horses. Every person that comes to my barn says the same thing, "You don't breed the typical Arab", and they mean this as a compliment. I don't mean to go off on a tangent but what I'm trying to say is I do agree with everyone's post that you shouldn't own a stallion just to own one. We don't know if the stallion Teri was going to buy is a stellar example or not, she was just wondering if her daughter could handle it or not. I will say this over and over again, IT'S ABOUT RESPONSIBILITY!!!!! The stallion and the girl both have to be taken in to consideration. I have met many 13 yr olds that I wouldn't want handling one of my mares and then I have met ones that would do fine (just like the anoymous poster)and myself! As TX Breeder stated, stallions can change and it can happen in an instant but again, responsibility. I guess I feel so strongly about this because I did ride and show a stallion at 13 but I guess I also wasn't your typical girl Anyone that owns a stallion knows, always be aware and always be careful! Sorry to ramble on |
Anonymous
Posted From: 205.188.116.13
| | Posted on Sunday, February 27, 2005 - 09:57 pm: |
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You can ramble all you want it is okay I too own Arabians, I am glad you had a great experience.. but you and a few others are the exception. A stallion who is not used for breeding should be gelded... for the very simple reason that if you are not using him for breeding there is no point in him remaining a stallion.
I do not know or have seen the stallion Teri is looking to buying... but two things are against this horse to begin with besides being a stallion
1. He is 3yrs old
2. He is untrained
It is my opinion that those two issues combined with the fact that he is a stallion just spells trouble when put in the hands of a child.. no matter how accomplished that child is...
Your right it is about responsibility..but as mentioned before this girl maybe perfectly abl to handle and ride the stallion.. but can you say that everyone who rides around her can do the same?
I still feel that a 13 yr old has no busieness riding a stallion... and a Stallion has no need to be a stallion if he is not breeding |
Tx Breeder
Posted From: 199.3.209.209
| | Posted on Monday, February 28, 2005 - 07:55 pm: |
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I offered my opinion based on many years in the business and many different situations. I was also that 13 year old that showed in open classes and was a very responsible young horseman. However, showing a stallion at that age was not allowed. My trainer let me work our stallion at home. I have Quarter Horses and Arabians standing here at my ranch. It is not about breed, but as it was stated in an earlier post, it is about responsibilty.
Who would be responsible for her? As a 13 year old, she is not. Others can be in danger if she is in a public situation and things go wrong. That puts a legal spin to all of this. I have testified in many legal cases as to equine responsibility.Anyone that own a stallion opens themselves up to a variety of liabilities.
My main point being, that unless you have an outstanding stallion, the facility and trainer, it is just not worth the problems that can befall a 13 year old and her family. Why go there?
There are so many wonderful horses that could enhance her learning experiences without the added headaches of a stallion. |
Bobby Ann Abbott
Neonate
Username: Baskmidnightshadow
Post Number: 3
Registered: 03-2005
| | Posted on Monday, May 02, 2005 - 04:33 pm: |
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I realize this post is old but I feel compelled to state my opinion. I have worked with some extremely well trained stallions and I have also worked with some trouble stallions. The girl is 13 and has worked with stallions before which is great but how much experience and what has she done with them. Next this horse is untrained has she ever trained a horse before. I never believed it would be a good idea for the first horse you ever train to be a stallion because you don't have room to make errors. If she is ready to be challenged more get a nice untrained gelding or mare and once you have more experience training then consider a stallion. And like I stated before what has she done with these stallions she works with is she just brushing them or feeding them what sort of handling is she doing and how well trained were they. There is a world of difference between purchasing a already well trained stallion and working with a trainer and buying a untrained stallion and attempting to train it. This is just my 2 cents. |
Anonymous
Posted From: 203.49.44.225
| | Posted on Thursday, September 22, 2005 - 05:58 am: |
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I am a 16 year old girl and have started handling stallions this year. There are two Quarter Horse stallions where i work and we don't paddock service. Just this afternoon, another teenager and myself were in charge of breeding one of our broodmares with our 3 year old colt who can be VERY difficult to handle at times as he is very coltish and loves to bite. I think that with the proper training and supervision, educated teenagers should be able to handle and ride stallions. I personally would not ride our colt but i would ride our older stallion as he is well trained and behaves perfectly at all times, even when he is used for breeding. I also disagree that a stallion that is not being used for breeding should be gelded. Those of you that are interested in the cutting world would agree with me that some of the best cutting horses are in fact stallions, wether or not they are used for breeding. Not all performance stallions are used for breeding. |
Bobby Ann Abbott
Nursing Foal
Username: Baskmidnightshadow
Post Number: 13
Registered: 03-2005
| | Posted on Friday, September 23, 2005 - 01:57 pm: |
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The difference of opinion on whether keeping a horse a stallion just to keep him a stallion is a discussion that will forever be ongoing as to many people having difference of opinion. So I am not going to get into it.
As for your statement for a young person to handle a stallion is valid. I didn't state that they shouldn't handle them (Heck I was riding our stallion bareback everywhere and taking him for trail rides with 30+ horses and by 19 was training my 2 year homebred stud colt - but all this was with supervision and I was currently working at a stud farm) But the girl in the forum is 14 and as I stated in my post we don't know what sort of stallions she has handled, how much training experience she has. To train a horses - for riding - is nothing you want to do first on a stallion especially one just realizing what he has between his legs. Next there is a reason they don't allow kids under a certain age to show stallions - LIABLILTY - Sometimes it has nothing to do with the stallions misbehavior trust me I have seem to some mares go crazy (when in heat) around a stallion. That is why I stated that for a first horse to train would be a nice gelding or mare - mistakes are easily overlooked or not as dangerous as they would be with a stallion. Remember the old saying if you give them an inch they will take a mile that is true of most stallions. |
starbuck588 (Unregistered Guest)
Unregistered guest
Posted From: 69.115.8.16
| | Posted on Tuesday, October 04, 2005 - 01:03 pm: |
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i would say its really up to your daughter wheter SHE feels she can definatly handle the horse, but like many stated the horse cannot be trusted as well as geldings or mare...(i know i love my gelding and never wished for him to be a stallion and im glad hes not one) also you should let her know if she} does get the staillion she cant go on trail rides (by herself or with people) because the stallion may do anything (heck ANY horse may do anything) me personally (this is coming from a 14 year old) i would not want a stallion because they can become grouchy and pissed off just because they smell a mare in heat
this is just my opinion |
Anonymous
Posted From: 71.245.129.197
| | Posted on Sunday, November 06, 2005 - 10:40 am: |
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I think that as long as the child is educated in stallion handling and reads up on and wants to continue her education in stallion handling go for it! Stallions can make amazing riding, driving and companion animals. I just got my 4th stallion and I am only 20. I got my first stallion at 9 and he was better behaved than anyone of my geldings ALWAYS. I NEVER have had any problems with any of my stallions even when there was a mare in heat on the farm weather they were breeding that season or not. with proper handling and supervision there is no reason that anyone couldn't handle a stallion safely. and just as my oppinion I do not think that any horse not used for breeding should be gelded. besides- I have a GELDING (NOT proud cut) that got lose with my mare- he mounted a mare that was in heat and acted more studdy than any of my studs from then on... ) but again- just my oppinion and experience. the best way to learn anything is to hear everyones storys and weight the options and posibilities... |
mark blinkerlin
Neonate
Username: Mark
Post Number: 1
Registered: 03-2006
| | Posted on Saturday, March 18, 2006 - 08:23 pm: |
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terry i agree you should not get a stallion fro your daughter unless shes big and can handel him but i doubt a 13 is that big so dont and aribians arent the best coice!!! there to hiper!!! |
SDS
Nursing Foal
Username: Whisper05
Post Number: 20
Registered: 03-2006
| | Posted on Sunday, March 19, 2006 - 04:21 pm: |
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I bought my stallion when I was 17,he was 11 months,he was a handful then, an Arabian also,he wasnt even halter trained at the time,he was and still is alot of work.After many years of owning him I still think "why did I do this to myself",although I probably wouldnt trade him for the world.I can say I did all my stallions training very early on,and it shows,I have rode him in trail rides without problem and even let my 13yo son ride him bareback,no bridle during breeding season,supervised of course.My stallion was the sweetest thing until he got sick last year,and now he is totally unpredicatable.Always remember a stallion can just blow up at any given minute,and sometimes it doesnt matter how well you know them or they are trained it is still dangerous to have one of any breed.In my opinion Arabians are a womans horse,they are more sensitive and more in tune with people than some of the other breeds,they are all not hyper or wild crazy "Arabs",alot of that goes to the breeding,feeding or handling.An Arabian stallion,told to me by an old breeder can hold a grudge and remember like an elephant,they are smart and sometimes too smart.I am not one to say yes or no about giving a 13yo a stallion,I was an avid rider at that age and knew more than my years,but getting my stallion kept me out of trouble and got me through some rough teenage years.Good luck,as Z said you can always geld if it doesnt work out. |
Lori
Nursing Foal
Username: Lori
Post Number: 15
Registered: 09-2004
| | Posted on Sunday, March 19, 2006 - 07:57 pm: |
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mark blinkerlin on your post:
OH PLLLEASE!!!!
Arabians are too hyper?! Did you know that the Arabian registry, their rules and the show rules is one of the ONLY registries that lets children handle stallions? QH do NOT.
Have you ever HAD an arabian? or an ARABIAN STALLION?!
Arabians were domesticated for thousands of years before any other horse, and they lived in tents.
The stallions lived side by side. The arabic people do not geld stallions, they just keep them and expect them to be horses. And why can they do that? because arabians are intellegent, gentle creatures that have dog like personalities. They were treasured family members, not beasts of burden, that was what the camels were for.
For more info on stallions in the real world, handled by real people, please visit:
www.Stallionhandlingandtraining@groups.msn.com
Lori |
Robin Culbertson
Nursing Foal
Username: Murrini
Post Number: 20
Registered: 02-2006
| | Posted on Sunday, March 19, 2006 - 10:01 pm: |
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Thank you Lori, I agree wholeheartedly! I have quite a few arabs and they are all great. People are shocked when they see how my horses act, always make a comment how arabs are susposed to be hot headed, Why are mine so good? I have known some arab stallions as well that you could do anything with them around mares and they were perfect gentlemen. Arabs get thier bad rap because they are so intelligent they learn they can push thier owners around and get away with stuff if the owners don't know what they are doing. As long as you know what you are doing they are wonderful horses that will do anything you ask of them. |
Jos
Board Administrator
Username: Jos
Post Number: 10528
Registered: 10-1999
| | Posted on Monday, March 20, 2006 - 01:41 am: |
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One of the easiest stallions I've ever handled was an Arabian.
One of the most difficult stallions I've ever handled was an Arabian.
I handle a lot of stallions each year, and have done for many years...
I don't think one can safely generalise in either direction with reference to the breed - or any breed for that matter. |
Kris Moos
Breeding Stock
Username: Kris
Post Number: 363
Registered: 01-2006
| | Posted on Monday, March 20, 2006 - 07:05 am: |
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I will stick up for arabs any day! I have owned 5 full arabs and a few 1/2 arabs, I have also owned around the same number of qh and corss breeds, and i have sold the qh and cross breeds after 2 to 4 years because i did not like them as much as my arabs, i have kept one arab for 16 years (the one to foal soon) and her daughter who is 11 ! they are VERY intelligent, willing and if exposed to the world a very good horse! arabs get such a bad rap because they are primarily a "show horse" and everyone keeps them locked in a barn to keep their manes and tails so pretty, then they go to shows and go home again...mine live outside (lean to ) and get ridden along roads, rivers, tractors machinery, atv's, kids, bikes, dogs whatever! many (including my vet who used to raise and show arabs) cannot believe mine are purebred, it has been said "they must not have read the "arab book", they dont have the arab fears and behaviors" and it is true, because i use them and treat them like any other working breed! granted they will not win an arabian beauty contest, but they could win an all purpose horse contest! I also agree with Robin, they are intelligent enough that they will out smart their owner..unless yo stay one step ahead of them ALL the time! I too awned an arab stallion...sweetest thing ever, even after breeding, but he was pastured with everybody, moms, babies, geldings and had been all his life, and he was handled, so he knew manners and new his place.
I think a lot of it with a stallion is personality!!! not breed!!!!!!! |
Lori
Nursing Foal
Username: Lori
Post Number: 16
Registered: 09-2004
| | Posted on Monday, March 20, 2006 - 07:23 am: |
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Arabians are highly intellegent and sensitive creatures. They were bred that way to be horses of war, they HAD to know what was coming/going/different to live and to protect.
They also like to be led, meaning they want to be obedient.
When left with a timid person, they will try to help the person by being in charge. They will try to protect the person by being extremely aware of surroundings, snorting to scare aware dangers, showing high head and tail, prancing to intimidate whatever danger there may be, and they do this to take charge of the situation. After all, the person is timid and someone has to be in charge!
They also cannot tolerate alot of pressure on their skin, heads, etc., So a person who is overly forceful with soon have a flighty, nervous horse if they constantly pull, tug, shank, kick or are otherwise rough with the horse.
That is pretty much how arabian horses get a bad rap. They are misunderstood, when actually they are the easist of horses to train and get along with.
Lori |
Kim Winter
Breeding Stock
Username: Clafairy
Post Number: 200
Registered: 07-2005
| | Posted on Monday, March 20, 2006 - 09:04 am: |
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I think this arguement depends on where you come from and what you have been exposed to - Untill I started to look into breeding I had NO idea that Arabs where so wonderful - I would never have bought a purebred arab. The part bred childrens ponies are fun - but need experienced rider (this is my old opinion) and the purebreds are way to highly strung....
Now, I see from breeding that many Horses are crossed successfuly with arabs - They are versatile, can turn on a dime, jump, race, endurance etc etc... Im very impressed
My friend owns two, they were both insane when she got them but now they are being kept VERY naturally and they are ridden by the most nervous children (both mares I should add) These horses were severley disturbed when she got them but now - you would think they are different mares.
another of my friends,I didnt even realise had arabs - She had two horses, she is the only person I now in the county that rides out bareback on a halter, Then I find out they are Arabs - Wow, I was impressed. She got them both as youngsters and the training was minimal - they are very astute animals and learn soooo quicky. My opinion is completely changed on this breed nowadays and I would love to own one myself - but If I had one of every breed I wanted that would be too many!!! |
Kris Moos
Breeding Stock
Username: Kris
Post Number: 365
Registered: 01-2006
| | Posted on Monday, March 20, 2006 - 09:26 am: |
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both my arabs were broke by me, i am not a trainer, just a "pleasure" horse owner, the first day saddled we rode and have been riding ever since! both can be ridden bareback and halter , one by ANY body, young old whatever, the otehr by someine who knows how to ride just because she is more of a tester! but behaves wonderfully when told to and is broke super!
I am hoping my mares (soon to be foal), 1/2 arab. 1/2 qh will be as willing and easy!!!
stallions if not properly trained and handled will be dangeroust to themselves and others!!! especially one used JUST for breeding! |
