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Mare aborted?

Equine-Reproduction.com Bulletin Board » Abortion and Pregnancy Loss » Mare aborted? « Previous Next »


Author Message
 

Cindy
Weanling
Username: Cweber

Post Number: 33
Registered: 06-2005
Posted on Saturday, September 04, 2010 - 06:52 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

She is/was 2 1/2 months along and I went out today and there was a wet spot running from her vulva (about 5 inches wide (give or take) off the point of her butt. When I got a kleenex and wiped it it was bright orange/rust colored with a water consistancy. Thinking placental fluid?? Anything else you could think it might be or probably not looking good? I will be getting her for an ultrasound but thought I would ask in the meantime. She does have a Grade IIB uterus so this is not shocking but we had hoped. Yes she was cultured/cytology done and DMSO lavaged prior to breeding...
 

Cynthia Adams
Neonate
Username: Cnm

Post Number: 6
Registered: 04-2009
Posted on Saturday, September 04, 2010 - 11:27 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Oh Cindy, so sorry to hear that. I know how much you wanted a foal out of that mare. I will keep my fingers crossed for you
 

Cjskip
Senior Stallion or Mare
Username: Cjskip

Post Number: 1405
Registered: 03-2008
Posted on Sunday, September 05, 2010 - 01:38 am:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Cindy, I just saw this. I have so much more time to cruse now-

I am really sorry to hear that it sounds like your mare aborted. What is the final word?

Could you start breeding her again very early in the season, so you have a better chance to have get a 2012 foal?
 

Cindy
Weanling
Username: Cweber

Post Number: 34
Registered: 06-2005
Posted on Tuesday, September 07, 2010 - 07:53 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

We ultrasounded her today and everything looks just fine! Yet, I got her home and she turned around and squirted out the back end (though this time it did look like urine)so I don't know what the heck is going on. . So maybe just a hormone flash going on there. Still don't know why she had the orange/rust colored fluid on her the other day as the vets can't find anything wrong. So I guess we will just continue to wait and see how things go. So I guess it is a positive thing that she is still in foal!
 

Brittany Hindes
Breeding Stock
Username: Bhindes

Post Number: 115
Registered: 08-2009
Posted on Tuesday, September 07, 2010 - 09:20 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Yeah she is still in foal. Glad everything went ok.
 

Pam Romjue
Nursing Foal
Username: Pammy

Post Number: 13
Registered: 08-2008
Posted on Tuesday, September 07, 2010 - 09:38 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Congrats! That is wonderful news!!!
 

Cindy
Weanling
Username: Cweber

Post Number: 35
Registered: 06-2005
Posted on Wednesday, September 08, 2010 - 07:36 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

So far but we have a LONG wasy to go yet!! Thanks for the good wishes though, we can definately use them!
 

Cindy
Weanling
Username: Cweber

Post Number: 36
Registered: 06-2005
Posted on Friday, October 15, 2010 - 12:43 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

So my mare was just palpated today at 112 days and the pregnancy feels good (or what part she could feel) the vet said. However, she does still have a fair bit of crusties on her backend. It is still bright orange when wet but dries crusted all the way down in between her hindlegs a bit. I have been washing it and trying to keep it clean but it is still burning in the odd spots. Any idea what might be going on? The odd time she still has wet on the point of her butt so not sure if she is peeing into the wind or leaking while lying down and it is running that way. My vet was going to go talk to another vet about it and maybe possibly run her on a course of antibiotics. Any thoughts?
Also she was thinking of checking her pregesterone levels, what should they be at this stage of her pregnancy?
She had a clean culture/cytology this spring.
 

Jos
Board Administrator
Username: Admin

Post Number: 3024
Registered: 10-1999
Posted on Friday, October 15, 2010 - 01:43 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

However, she does still have a fair bit of crusties on her backend. It is still bright orange when wet but dries crusted all the way down in between her hindlegs a bit. I have been washing it and trying to keep it clean but it is still burning in the odd spots. Any idea what might be going on?

The most likely answer is that it is estrogenic urine.

My vet was going to go talk to another vet about it and maybe possibly run her on a course of antibiotics. Any thoughts?

Not much point in using antibiotics unless there is an identified pathogenic presence, and potential for harm if it's not needed...

Also she was thinking of checking her pregesterone levels, what should they be at this stage of her pregnancy?

Zero or close to it. Read our article at this location.
 

Cindy
Weanling
Username: Cweber

Post Number: 37
Registered: 06-2005
Posted on Friday, October 15, 2010 - 02:42 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Is it common for them to have burning and a "dirty" hindend with the estrogenic urine? Will she do this her whole pregnancy? She has not had an issue with it in the past.

How would they identify a "pathogenic presence", culture what is coming out?

So I take it there is no point in checking her progesterone levels then. My vet had mentioned something about the uterus taking over from the ovaries at producing progesterone and she was concerned because of her crappy uterus it may not do a sufficient job and wanted to check her levels. I guess if we have made it this far we are past the high risk area and not a concern.

I am paticularly paranoid after she has lost her last 3 pregnancies (1 to placentitis and the other two she lost early) so want to pull out all the stops we can and not skip anything!
 

Cindy
Weanling
Username: Cweber

Post Number: 38
Registered: 06-2005
Posted on Friday, October 15, 2010 - 03:12 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I wonder if she is doing an estrogen (not progesterone) test or would that not make sense? I will have to double check.
 

Jos
Board Administrator
Username: Admin

Post Number: 3025
Registered: 10-1999
Posted on Friday, October 15, 2010 - 05:54 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Is it common for them to have burning and a "dirty" hindend with the estrogenic urine? Will she do this her whole pregnancy? She has not had an issue with it in the past.

Estrogens are increased at certain stages of pregnancy. Urine scalding can occur. The two may not be connected - i.e. the colouration may be related to the estrogens while the scalding related to an acidic nature of the urine.

How would they identify a "pathogenic presence", culture what is coming out?

It would be difficult to achieve. Swabbing (and culture) of exudate is going to identify organisms, as there will be surface contamination. One could not confirm true pathogenic nature. A swab from the caudal portion of the cervix might be beneficial, but even then, risk of contamination is significant. My point was more directed to the fact that it is unlikely that there are any pathogens present...

My vet had mentioned something about the uterus taking over from the ovaries at producing progesterone and she was concerned because of her crappy uterus it may not do a sufficient job and wanted to check her levels.

If this is truly what they said, it is incorrect.

Early on the CL's on the ovaries produce progesterone. From about 45 days on, the placenta is forming, and it is the feto-placental unit that by about 90 days is producing progestins not progesterone. In other words, they have the wrong hormone (it's not progesterone that's being produced) and the wrong source of manufacture (the uterus produces nothing). The fact that she does or doesn't have "a crappy uterus" is therefore irrelevant.

I wonder if she is doing an estrogen (not progesterone) test or would that not make sense?

I doubt it. The only thing an estrogen evaluation would prove at this stage is that the foal is still pregnant - which you already know. My guess is that they were erroneously thinking that progesterone levels were significant at this point.

You might want to seek a second opinion from a veterinarian experienced in equine reproduction - preferably a theriogenologist.
 

Cindy
Weanling
Username: Cweber

Post Number: 39
Registered: 06-2005
Posted on Friday, October 15, 2010 - 07:06 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I probably had it wrong Jos and will check with them to get more info and clarify. They may be theriogenologists (though don't know if they are certified or anything) as all they do is full time equine reproduction and have quite a large client base. Thanks as always for your informative posts, the more info I can get the better "armed" I will be
 

Jos
Board Administrator
Username: Admin

Post Number: 3026
Registered: 10-1999
Posted on Sunday, October 17, 2010 - 02:54 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

FYI a theriogenologist is a board-certified specialist in reproduction (not specifically equine), so one cannot be a theriogenologist and not be certified...



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