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Dummy beginner questinons

Equine-Reproduction.com Bulletin Board » General Mare Questions - Volume 1 » Dummy beginner questinons « Previous Next »


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Anonymous
Posted From: 4.152.3.154
Posted on Sunday, July 11, 2004 - 10:54 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Ok, sorry for this but I am soo confused. I understand that people are on a 21-day cycle and horses are on a 28-day cycle. So people ovulate 14 days after the first day of their period (no matter how long or short their period is), Is this the same in horses? Do they ovulate 14 days after the first sign of estrus? Our mare began showing signs of heat 12 days ago and her cervix is still open so we are still inseminating her. How much longer is her cervix going to stay open? Also, if we already caught her (say, on Wed.) and we inseminate again on Sun. (providing the cervix is still open) will we cause an abortion of an already fertilized egg?

I little bit of my history...
I am a first time stallion owner and breeder. My 3 year old is a great breeder and ejaculates very quickly with ground collecting after being stated by Jos and Kathy back in Feb. I collected him and inseminated a mare for my first time ever 2 months ago and I guess it was beginners luck but we have our first baby on the way. She is about 45 days along now. Thanks Jos and Kathy!!

I apologize for the dummy beginner questions. I just can't seem to find the answers anywhere, and I'm terrible with graphs, don't understand them. Thanks for the help
 

Jos
Posted From: 137.186.22.238
Posted on Sunday, July 11, 2004 - 11:42 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I understand that people are on a 21-day cycle and horses are on a 28-day cycle.

Wrong! :-) Other way around - horses are 21 humans are 28.

You cannot compare human and equine cycles. They are completely different. There is no menstruation in horses and no "heat" in humans, and the hormonal cycle is completely different. If you stop trying to compare the two, life will become much easier for you!! :-)

Taking a look at this article on the hormonal cycle of the mare (click on the link) will probably help a bundle too!

In a nutshell (and remember there will be variations in the exact number of days):
  • 21 day cycle from ovulation to ovulation;
  • 5-7 day estrus ("heat") phase when the mare is receptive to the stallion;
  • mare will generally ovulate in the last 24-48 hours of "heat", this will typically be 3-5 days after the initial onset of signs of estrus;
  • the cervix will be closing about 2-3 days after ovulation, but the degree of cervical relaxation can vary from mare to mare;
  • after going out of "heat" the mare will display about 14-16 days of non-receptiveness to the stallion (called diestrus).
 

Anonymous
Posted From: 4.152.3.154
Posted on Monday, July 12, 2004 - 12:13 am:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

OK, thanks for the correction people vs. horses.

I'm still confused about the cervix. Why would she still be open? Could she just have a relaxed cervix during diestus?
 

Jos
Posted From: 137.186.22.238
Posted on Monday, July 12, 2004 - 12:23 am:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

What were the signs of estrus you saw 12 days ago? Was the cervix open then?

Chances are that the signs were an early warning of estrus - possibly even behavioural submissive responses rather than true estrus display.

The cervix closes as a result of an increased progesterone level, which is brought about by the formation of a Corpus Luteum ("CL") that is formed in the evacuated follicle space following ovulation. Hence, you need the ovulation in order to see increased cervical tone.

Hard to say exactly what is going on from a distance, but I suspect that the above is a good possibility.
 

Anonymous
Posted From: 4.152.3.154
Posted on Monday, July 12, 2004 - 12:42 am:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The mare was brought to us around the beginning of June and I teased her everyday for about 10 minutes with clear results of diestrus. Pinning ears and kicking at stallion. Then we left for vacation (first one in 18 years) on Sat. 26th and of course I receive a call from the barn on Tues the 28th that she was displaying to the horses being led by her stall. We returned on the following Sat.the 3rd. I palpated her on Sun. and felt an open cervix, so we collected and inseminated her. Same for Mon. Gave Tues. off, Inseminated on Wed. Gave Thur. and Fri. off ( sick child) Then dropped the dang specimen on Sat. Palpated on Sun and still open, (but not as much) so inseminated again with very little semen because the disposable liner broke with first ejaculate. OOPS!
Ok, sorry for the long story, but am I way off base? Is it time to stop and wait for her next cycle?
 

Jos
Posted From: 137.186.22.238
Posted on Monday, July 12, 2004 - 12:51 am:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

My guess as above still holds... :-)

I suspect that what was originally seen as "showing" may have been early displays. You palpated an open cervix on the 3rd, and it is still open now a week later, although you think probably closing. Hence - if you had palpated earlier, you would probably have found a relaxed cervix for about 10 days. If the mare has a 7 days estrus period, and then the cervix takes another 3 days or so to close, you're up to 10 days. If the mare happens to have a second follicle that she is ovulating on, then the additional estrogen (from that second follicle) can - to a small extent - override the initial closure effect of the first developing CL. Note that this delay will not be prolonged, but may account for an extra day or so.

So... if you were to check her tomorrow (later today :-) ??), I think you will find an even tighter cervix, and not need to breed again.

You may want to make doubly sure that you ultrasound at +/- 14 days, and again at 28 days for the possibility of twins though.
 

Anonymous
Posted From: 4.152.3.154
Posted on Monday, July 12, 2004 - 01:03 am:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Ok, THANK YOU, THANK YOU, THANK YOU!!!!!

You're the best!



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