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More Extender Delimas/Questions

Equine-Reproduction.com Bulletin Board » Transported Semen » More Extender Delimas/Questions « Previous Next »


Author Message
 

Acme Acres
Neonate
Username: Acmeacres

Post Number: 7
Registered: 06-2005
Posted on Wednesday, May 03, 2006 - 02:57 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

On Easter, we had an AI tech collect and cool our stallion to see if
he'd ship as we had mares out of state to be bred to him.

Collection was 153, motility was 85%. He cooled him in Inra and at
24 hours his motility was at 25%. We decided to investigate other
extenders as options due to him only using Inra. When we cooled on
our test, we used Inra, Max Semen Plus, Dr Kenney (plain, Amikpen and
Tic), Universal (also with the same extenders) all from Exodus
Breeders.

We ran checks at 12, 18, 24, 36, 48 and 72 hrs. Monday, we had to
ship the mares so we went with the Inra (as we had already had 2
tests at 24 hours done and knew while it was very low, it would
be "acceptable") and also 2 doses of Max Semen Plus (the vet
requested 4 doses be sent for the 2 mares). We did our 72 hr check
Monday after we'd gotten the goods off to FedEx. At 72 hrs, the Max
looked decent and the Motility seemed better with the Kenny T.
Today, I got the shipped semen report I sent to the vet that noted
volume, motility, extender, etc. We also have a place in there for
the vet to note the motility and extender for his test results upon
arrival, which were noted as 30% Motility (15-20% progressive)from
the Inra and 50% motility (30% progressive) on the Max Semen.

Would we be wise to try the Ez-Mixin extenders from ARS to see if we
get better results from them? I know the values are actually very
low and not good for getting mares in foal on the shipments, but
wondered if we'd be better off to try different extender ratios,
completely different products, should the cooled motility rate
inprove as he gets older? .... etc.

Background on the horse: 3 yr old Paint stallion, last collection
(shipment collection), values were 22 mL collected (gel free), count
was 274 mil/mL and the motility again was right around 85% (we
calculated the extender based on 80%) and used a 5:1 ratio of both
extenders.
 

Jos
Board Administrator
Username: Jos

Post Number: 10630
Registered: 10-1999
Posted on Thursday, May 04, 2006 - 03:31 am:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

You've already tried the EZ-mixin' :-) They're nothing more than a brand-name Kenney!

I wouldn't bother checking as often as you are. Checking at 24, 48 and 72 hours is sufficient. Every time you open the container to get a sample out to check you're warming up the samples, and that can have a negative impact.

You're not diluting the sample sufficiently at 5:1 with an initial concentration of 275 x106. You need a final concentration of between 25-50 million sperm/ml (and ideally about 25), so you should be diluting 10:1! the exception with that is the INRA '96 which can be used at a lower dilution, but is still likely to produce better results if the ratio is higher.

I would rerun your tests diluting to the desired concentration rather than using a ratio. Use the semen calculator that we provide to sort out your dilutions. Hopefully that will help.
 

Acme Acres
Neonate
Username: Acmeacres

Post Number: 8
Registered: 06-2005
Posted on Thursday, May 04, 2006 - 12:02 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Thanks Jos,
I was wondering if it was infact the same, but as with things from my work, they may be very close, but one little difference means they're not the "exact" same (other than who's handling and labeling). The main reason we checked at 12 and 18 hours was to see where it stood based on arrival time, although we are aware that it was pretty quick.

Knock on wood, we don't have to reship, but if we do, I'll definatly extend it out further! I was afraid we'd extend too far.

Are you familiar with the Max Semen Plus at all? I've tried to do research on it but very little comes up.
 

Jos
Board Administrator
Username: Jos

Post Number: 10632
Registered: 10-1999
Posted on Saturday, May 06, 2006 - 12:57 am:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Max Semen plus was developed in Brazil and is specifically aimed at poor shippers. As you are aware, it is sold by BET Pharm (see the link below the board). It is certainly worth while trying it as one of the panel of extenders at the beginning of each season, even if you don't have poor shippers, as it will work well for some others too.
 

stacey Huntington, DVM
Neonate
Username: Staceyj

Post Number: 1
Registered: 06-2007
Posted on Saturday, June 23, 2007 - 05:03 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I've been inseminating mares with cooled semen for about 15 years in my practice. I believe that I receive more poor-quality semen now than I used to get - seems like so many stallion owners/managers don't put enough effort into their shipments and I get several batches every year with low numbers, poor progressive motility. No particular breed stands out, it's just that so many more people are shipping than used to. One of the frustrating things I've run into in the past couple of years is people who ship with INRA and use it in place of good stallion management. I consistently get poor quality semen when it's shipped in INRA.A few of the stallions were moved to new farms with different extenders and their pregnancy rates went up greatly. Do I need a refresher course in my mare management? I am really frustrated by this development - it is taking alot of the fun out of breeding my clients' mares. Comments?
 

Jos
Board Administrator
Username: Admin

Post Number: 1386
Registered: 10-1999
Posted on Sunday, June 24, 2007 - 12:45 am:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I sympathize with your concerns! :-)

Steps that we have taken to promote better management at the shipping end include presentation of the semen calculator as we see each week at our courses blank looks of incomprehension when it comes to the mathematics! We also strongly encourage people to perform a pre-breeding season semen extender evaluation on their stallions and in fact offer that service as do others.

We have no doubt that education is the key to better shipments. It is one of the reasons that we have the short courses. The more everyone knows, the better everyone - the horses included - will be!

There is no reason why there should be a prevalence of poor quality shipments specifically associated with the use of the INRA '96 extender, unless the semen is not being prepared correctly, or perhaps that you are receiving semen from stallions that are not good shippers, and would perhaps not ship at all if it were not for the use of INRA '96! Do not however lose sight of the fact that low motility alone is not necessarily an issue that will reduce pregnancy rates. We recently dealt with this in an article on the site that discusses low motility in received shipments, and the (incorrect) concept that an insemination dose must contain 500 x 106 progressively motile sperm in order to achieve good pregnancy rates - don't lose hope yet! :-)

Another thing that we do and encourage others to do through the courses and web site is not hesitating to document incoming semen shipment quality and send a report back with the container when returned to the stallion owner. This report may be either good or bad depending upon the condition of the semen received, but in either event it will hopefully be received in the spirit in which it was sent - as an educational tool. Items that we include in the report are:
  • Progressive motility cooled (i.e. upon receipt);
  • Progressive motility when correctly warmed;
  • Concentration (per hemacytometer count);
  • General comment on condition (i.e. clean/dirty; Too dilute/concentrated; No paperwork included etc.);
  • And - if the semen is particularly noteworthy - good or bad - we will send back a CD or VHS tape of the sperm videoed under the microscope, which is really hard to argue with! :-).
Do you need a refresher course? I can't really answer that one :-) but I will say that there have been quite a few advances in the last few years, so although they won't necessarily assist you with the quality of the semen you're getting (that's another battle to be fought elsewhere!!!) it still might be of interest to you.

I hope some of the above suggestions might be of interest and use to you if you are not already doing them.
 

stacey Huntington, DVM
Neonate
Username: Staceyj

Post Number: 2
Registered: 06-2007
Posted on Sunday, June 24, 2007 - 10:09 am:   Edit Post Delete Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Thank you for your comments. I sincerely believe that the INRA is being used in place of the management. I do like to report back to the mare and stallion owners about the quality of the semen I receive, good or bad, but if there is hostility on either side, there's not much that's going to change. I do understand that motility is not the beat-all and end-all of the semen quality and always at least "guestimate" the concentration based on other samples I've seen.I've only received a few INRA semen samples but they have all had no paperwork either. And some of them are coming from farms or facilities that should know better! Thank you for your comments and quick response.


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